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Post by Legacy2.0 on Sept 9, 2014 13:51:41 GMT -5
I heard the company will only give 2 tier full pay if we all give up the ford sponsored Heathcare and get on the affordable Heathcare act (Obama Care) I hope it's not so
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Post by saugerman on Sept 9, 2014 13:54:46 GMT -5
no thanx
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Post by brizzel on Sept 9, 2014 13:56:26 GMT -5
Not going to happen. 2nd tier will get paid to in time. It doesn't happen overnight.
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Post by Legacy2.0 on Sept 9, 2014 14:13:05 GMT -5
It takes time clearly
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Post by laptier2 on Sept 9, 2014 14:18:50 GMT -5
we will all eventually be on obamacare, its cheaper for companies to pay the penalty!!!!!
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Post by hoghead on Sept 9, 2014 14:46:43 GMT -5
No one on here wants to be on Obamacare. Then why did the union and our dues go to re-elect Obama. I agree we will all be on Obamacare. THANKS U.A.W.
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Post by saugerman on Sept 9, 2014 14:47:10 GMT -5
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Post by lap65 on Sept 9, 2014 15:01:44 GMT -5
Pitchforks & torches!
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Post by turk182 on Sept 9, 2014 16:44:18 GMT -5
Will the i.u.a.w. also be on obama or just us.thats the question i'll be askin those crooks
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Post by crowdogg on Sept 10, 2014 9:39:15 GMT -5
The entire two tier system is nothing but lies and bullshit.
First off, in SEVEN years, not a single person has moved from tier two up to tier one. It's bullshit that Ford can just keep hiring people and as long as they put them under any one of the multiple titles that aren't counted towards the 20% cap.
Second, the numbers on the recent 80/20 report (from 7/27/14) don't match the numbers on the system wide report (from7/31/14).
Third, I'd like to see a list of exactly how many and at what plants the insourced employees are at.
How many actual countable entry level employees are there? My math says 6,024; so we need 2,338 more real, countable entry level employees in order for any one to move up to tier one.
But, based off the numbers in the system wide seniority list, which says that are only 281 entry level at Rawsonville and 406 at Sterling, the numbers change to 11,893 allowable, 10,631 current total, 7,393 actual countable entry level and 1,262 more needed to hit the 8,655 entry level 20% cap.
So why does the system wide list show 281 at Rawsonville and 406 at Sterling but the 80/20 report shows 623 at Rawsonville and 1525 at Sterling? Where's the truth in reporting?
If a company paid a minority employee or a female employee less than a white male for doing the same job, it would be illegal. But It's ok to pay us different wages for the same work because we have a bargaining agreement!? F that.
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Post by lap65 on Sept 10, 2014 12:17:12 GMT -5
7 years? We've been on this contract 7 years, did I miss something.
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Post by crowdogg on Sept 10, 2014 12:24:17 GMT -5
Yes 7 years, the two tier system started in the 2007 contract.
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Post by wildcats34 on Sept 10, 2014 12:37:58 GMT -5
Two tier need more people like you crow dog. Too many youngins happy at $15.
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Post by roaddog on Sept 10, 2014 13:48:32 GMT -5
The UAW always endorses Dumbocrats, No matter how much they suck !
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Post by crowdogg on Sept 10, 2014 16:14:07 GMT -5
Two tier need more people like you crow dog. Too many youngins happy at $15. I am the way I am because of my circumstances. $17 an hour ain't shit. I made more money on my first paycheck with Ford than I do now. I'm one of a small group from Twin Cities Assembly Plant that was hired between November 2006 and November 2007. We were hired under the 2003 contract as TPT's and started at $19/hr plus the $2 COLA at time, with the standard 5% raise every 26 weeks. Never did they play the 89 day game on us, we had got our 90 days and were relieved that we had made it without getting cut at 89! When the contract came out in 2007 which began the new entry level wage of $15/hr and restructured the TPT's, we had already got our 90 days so we were unaffected, yet we got lost somewhere in the mix. So time went on and we were making $28/hr, for years, We worked the exact same schedule and hours as "full time/legacy" employees. Then the 2009 concessions came and we gave up our COLA and break time and such just like everyone else. Finally it came to be that our plant closed in December 2011. This small group of what came to be called "Super TPT's" was told that Ford didn't owe us anything, regardless of the fact that we had gained 4-5 years plant seniority and continuously worked for Ford throughout that time. So our local union bargained for us, they bargained that they would give us preferential hiring if we chose pay our own way to move and accept employment at a different plant as a new tier two employee as defined under the 2011 contract. WAIT, we've been working for 4-5 years at full scale, completed our 90 days, had benefits, what!? Aren't WE "real" employees, we got our 90 days in while still under the 2003 contract, doesn't that make us "real" employees? So some of us picked up and moved, on our own dime, to Chicago or Louisville to continue our careers with Ford. We lost all of our seniority, got new hire dates, wages cut from $28 to $16 an hour and had to go through the waiting periods for benefits again as well as go through the 90 day probation period again. How is this right or fair? We would have been the last people EVER hired into Ford that still makes full scale, to still get a PENSION. We were the last people to get our 90 in before the doomsday 2007 contract that began a new low wage and got rid of pensions. How can you let someone work for 5 years at full scale and then just cut us back and hit the "reset button"?
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Post by justaworker on Sept 10, 2014 17:25:12 GMT -5
Crowdog, you all got screwed more than most. But you were a temporary employee. No idea why you chose to move down here and take this job. good luck though brother.
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Post by justaworker on Sept 10, 2014 17:37:08 GMT -5
Also, a few hundred people in Chicago went through the same thing. Worked a few years at full pay, got laid off, came back to same plant making $15....crazy
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Post by wildcats34 on Sept 10, 2014 20:35:35 GMT -5
I dont like making two tier wage, but listening to your story kind of pissed me off, and not feel as bad making the money I make. I couldn't imagine getting an almost $13 pay cut. Off topic a little, but with Michigan being right to work, what are the numbers people taking advantage of it?
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Post by justaworker on Sept 10, 2014 21:18:15 GMT -5
I dont like making two tier wage, but listening to your story kind of pissed me off, and not feel as bad making the money I make. I couldn't imagine getting an almost $13 pay cut. Off topic a little, but with Michigan being right to work, what are the numbers people taking advantage of it? Not sure, uaw members haven't had the chance to opt out yet. We were already under our contract when the law passed. Will have to wait until this contract expires.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 10, 2014 21:30:24 GMT -5
It will happen. Hope all those that wanted "Hope and Change" have all the change they ever needed now. It will come in handy to pay for your health care. I bet it wont be just 2nd tier, Im sure it will be every dam one of us. When Hitlary gets elected it will only get worse.
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Post by fordworker95 on Sept 11, 2014 3:53:43 GMT -5
It will happen. Hope all those that wanted "Hope and Change" have all the change they ever needed now. It will come in handy to pay for your health care. I bet it wont be just 2nd tier, Im sure it will be every dam one of us. When Hitlary gets elected it will only get worse. If you think Obama and Hillary are bad,go and ask mitch mcconnell or john boehner what there position is on the same issues. If they had there way,no one would have healthcare unless they paid BIG premiums to insurance companies and there would be no employer sponsored healthcare. Be Careful what you ask for you might get it .
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Post by Deleted on Sept 11, 2014 7:14:36 GMT -5
I'm not a fan of McConnell by no means, but his stance on the HC issue was still better than obamas forced socialist healthcare.
Also to let you know, Im not a fan of the republicans either. Both sides are f*cked up.
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Post by crowdogg on Sept 11, 2014 10:25:10 GMT -5
The problem isn't necessarily with insurance, it's with the actual cost of healthcare. Insurance conpanies have to charge a ton in premiums because the hospitals and doctors charge too much. We all wish that companies would just do the right thing, but in a free market / capitalism type of environment, you can't force anyone to charge less for goods or services. The demand of consumers is what dictates the prices, and unfortunately, healthcare is one of only a few things that the demand for doesn't ever really decrease, regardless of the price.
So what happens when the prices of things get too high and the seller or provider of those items refuses to lower the price? Demand falls and the provider is forced to lower prices. But since healthcare is always in demand, they don't have to lower prices. So the next step to get them to lower the prices is for the government to make policy to "convince" (force) them to do the right thing and lower the price. But once again, healthcare is tricky. So the government goes after insurance companies first, then later on it will go after the actual healthcare industry.
And if you don't agree that healthcare costs too much, here's two examples: Last year my wife had a minor surgery and stayed one night in the hospital. The bill for that surgery was $1,800 for the surgeon's part of it. The hospital charged $33,000 for providing a facility to do the surgery in. RIDICULOUS!
A few years ago I went to the hospital and got 3 stitches on my eyebrow. The bill was $2,900. For 3 stitches, I was in and out in under an hour. RIDICULOUS!
Granted the insurance company negotiated those prices down and paid the majority if the bills for me; but what if you don't have an insurance company to negotiate the price down for you? You would get F'd.
So one example of how the health industry could just do the right thing is to lower their prices to the lower amounts that they accept as payment from insurance companies after negotiating. If they are satisfied with a lesser payment from insurance companies, then why don't they just charge that lower amount to begin with?
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Post by saugerman on Sept 11, 2014 15:31:37 GMT -5
It will happen. Hope all those that wanted "Hope and Change" have all the change they ever needed now. It will come in handy to pay for your health care. I bet it wont be just 2nd tier, Im sure it will be every dam one of us. When Hitlary gets elected it will only get worse. If you think Obama and Hillary are bad,go and ask mitch mcconnell or john boehner what there position is on the same issues. If they had there way,no one would have healthcare unless they paid BIG premiums to insurance companies and there would be no employer sponsored healthcare. Be Careful what you ask for you might get it . Be careful what you ask for? they already did and he has screwed up and divided this country more than ever before...no thanx to dump-a-crap rule...it only pays if you don't work for a living
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Post by fordworker95 on Sept 12, 2014 4:09:08 GMT -5
For me its the lesser of two evils.No doubt that both parties are indifferent to blue collar workers like us.But without our union agreement regarding healthcare,we would be really screwed.Ask any supervisor at Ford what they pay out monthly for THERE insurance,and how even with them paying big premiums out of there pocket,the coverage they have is still worse than what we as union workers have,and we don't pay any out of pocket for the premiums.The healthcare industry and the insurance industry need to be reformed,and that can only happen in congress.Funny people call it obamacare,but congress had to vote it into law,he is president of the US,not KING.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 12, 2014 7:11:12 GMT -5
For me its the lesser of two evils.No doubt that both parties are indifferent to blue collar workers like us.But without our union agreement regarding healthcare,we would be really screwed.Ask any supervisor at Ford what they pay out monthly for THERE insurance,and how even with them paying big premiums out of there pocket,the coverage they have is still worse than what we as union workers have,and we don't pay any out of pocket for the premiums.The healthcare industry and the insurance industry need to be reformed,and that can only happen in congress. Funny people call it obamacare,but congress had to vote it into law,he is president of the US,not KING. Yea, but don't you remember how all this went down? You have to PASS this bill to know whats in it. Nancy Pelosi's famous quote.
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Post by TonyV on Sept 12, 2014 8:29:07 GMT -5
Democrats controlled congress and voted party lines for it. They had the majority in the Senate also. They own it lock, stock, and barrel. The UAW got an exemption until 2018 in the deal. After then, we will all be on OBAMACARE!
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Post by fordworker95 on Sept 12, 2014 15:32:01 GMT -5
Yea, but don't you remember how all this went down? You have to PASS this bill to know whats in it. Nancy Pelosi's famous quote. Read more: scottrlap.proboards.com/thread/14340/give-healthcare#ixzz3D8Ou1cRNI agree,neither party has there sh1t together.I haven't read the details of the law,and I wonder how many in congress read it before they voted on it.The reason I say lesser of two evils,is that republicans don't believe we should have union contracts and represent millionaires interest ahead of us blue collar workers.Our union is going the way of our country,No solidarity in the UAW and no solidarity in congress.Its every man for himself or the special interest that line the politicians pockets.That is true for dems and rep. Money in politics has to be removed for us to get real representation.
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ccrewdummie
Amateur
Just another face in the crowd
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Post by ccrewdummie on Sept 13, 2014 3:56:58 GMT -5
I have Been on my partners insurance for 6 yrs. she has been with Ford for 20 yrs. when I started at Ford 2 1/2 yrs ago I stayed on her insurance because it was better. At that time we paid very little if anything out of pocket. I had 2 surgeries. 5 yrs apart from each other. Both were the same just different results. First operations I was in hospital for 3 days. Other then co-pay I didn't pay anything out of pocket. This last one I was in hospital for 2 days and payed almost $1700 out of pocket. That was last year. Huge difference in a couple of years. It doesn't appear that Humana is better then BCBS except for the fact that BCBS will not cover allergies. It seems the company keeps changing the coverage to force everyone to go to BCBS.
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Post by wildcats34 on Sept 13, 2014 12:04:30 GMT -5
They ought to give two tier an option. Like you can have full pay, but you have to give up health insurance and 401k. With a stack of medical bills on the table that ford insurance didnt cover and the ability to invest my money for retirement in a better way, I would sign up. Shouldn't have to choose but given the option I would drop insurance and matching 401k. In this economy two tier wage isn't good! 10 to 12 years ago not near as bad.
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