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Post by richatktp1 on Jan 28, 2012 4:34:08 GMT -5
Right to Work will be passed into law very soon in Indiana. Comments....
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Post by buckeyeinky on Jan 28, 2012 7:24:36 GMT -5
no surprize,same ol republican union busting antics. just look around other republican gov....ohio, wisc. the right is in full attac mode on labor. bad thing for indians workers is not only are you a "at will " state but soon to be r2w ouch.
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Post by ScottR@KTP on Jan 28, 2012 8:27:09 GMT -5
They see it as a means of enticing manufacturing jobs...several states now have an edge in getting new jobs. If Toyota was just now coming to America, do you think there would be a enormous plant in Georgetown? Hell no, and they wouldn't be making what we make an hour. The plants in the deep south are paid very low wages...not even close to ours. Maybe this is the beginning of the end for unions. The union workforce is not happy being sold out...so maybe the anti-union movement is about to go to a whole new level?
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Post by kbrundag on Jan 28, 2012 9:13:14 GMT -5
A Union such as the UAW actually having to earn the trust, loyalty, respect and cash of the membership? Ridiculous... Should we pay a Union for what they have won in the past? Meaning higher wages and benefits? Or should we pay a Union for what they have won in the present? Meaning lower wages and fewer benefits?
I don't see it as union busting, I see it as turning unions into a service industry, do your job, give me what I want and there will be a nice tip in it for ya. Or, considering the service we now receive, you don't deserve Jack...
This should not kill a Union, it should make them better. Unfortunately, I think unions of today are killing themselves... Which seems painfully obvious, I don't see a lot of high praise for our leadership. Be afraid, be very afraid...
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Post by ktpelec on Jan 28, 2012 9:17:36 GMT -5
The Super PAC money is flooding into the "Right to Work" push. Radio and TV ads with skewed info on this topic. Check out the stats, the states that pay the lowest wages and have the most work related injuries are all "Right to Work" states. The only benefits on this issue go to the large corporations.
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jkiel
Amateur
"Live better. Work union."
Posts: 69
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Post by jkiel on Jan 28, 2012 10:06:01 GMT -5
The political rightwing in the U.S. is very slick & sophisticated---and successful. "Right to work" is huge lie; it doesn't give any one any "rights" or work. The way this evil filth works is (as I understand it), people who go to work at a company whose workers have a union, the anti-uinioners can opt out, and not pay any dues. But the union still has to represent those people. So, these people become "free riders." The union then has less money coming in, which, of course, weakens the union. It's union-busting, pure & simple. Quick fact: the last state to enact a so-called "right to work" law, Oklahoma in 2001, has lost over 20,000 manufacturing jobs since 2001.
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Post by axleman on Jan 28, 2012 10:35:14 GMT -5
A Union such as the UAW actually having to earn the trust, loyalty, respect and cash of the membership? Ridiculous... Should we pay a Union for what they have won in the past? Meaning higher wages and benefits? Or should we pay a Union for what they have won in the present? Meaning lower wages and fewer benefits? I don't see it as union busting, I see it as turning unions into a service industry, do your job, give me what I want and there will be a nice tip in it for ya. Or, considering the service we now receive, you don't deserve Jack... This should not kill a Union, it should make them better. Unfortunately, I think unions of today are killing themselves... Which seems painfully obvious, I don't see a lot of high praise for our leadership. Be afraid, be very afraid... I think "Right to work" will make unions concentrate on the people they represent more. This will force them to do what they should be doing, taking care of their people. If YOU control the flow of money YOU hold the power! It's very simple, a happy "rank and file" will support their union. A screwed over membership will cut off the funding to the union that sold them out!! REMEMBER,REMEMBER!!! This could force some very needed changes, especially with International UAW.
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Post by chaplain on Jan 28, 2012 11:38:37 GMT -5
A friend of mine works for a concrete company in Indiana as a truck driver. His shop is represented by the Teamsters. The Teamsters come in and screw them all the time. Everyone in his shop hates the Teamsters. But they have no choice but to pay the Teamsters their union dues. He said once this passes in Indiana. Everyone of them, in his shop are going to take their chances and opt out. They see this as the only way to make a statement with their union. They are NOT getting what they are paying for. Maybe this will wake up the upper echelon in the teamsters union.
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Post by kbrundag on Jan 28, 2012 11:46:19 GMT -5
A friend of mine works for a concrete company in Indiana as a truck driver. His shop is represented by the Teamsters. The Teamsters come in and screw them all the time. Everyone in his shop hates the Teamsters. But they have no choice but to pay the Teamsters their union dues. He said once this passes in Indiana. Everyone of them, in his shop are going to take their chances and opt out. They see this as the only way to make a statement with their union. They are NOT getting what they are paying for. Maybe this will wake up the upper echelon in the teamsters union. Great post, exactly what I'm talking about... If you are union leadership, just do your damn job like the rest of us and you have nothing to worry about. Of the people, for the people...
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Post by chaplain on Jan 28, 2012 13:41:30 GMT -5
I have no problems paying union dues if my union does what they are supposed to due. But, if they decide they want to neglect the workers, the people they say they are fighting for, it's really the only way you can make a statement. What other choice do you have? It's hard to get rid of some of the people in the upper positions at the international level that have been camped out there for years. It's kind of like the politicians we now have in Washington DC. On both sides. They can preach to the membership all they want, but their actions speak for themselves. I have a friend that lives on a lake in Minnesota. He had two new neighbors move in last year or the year before. He was wondering what they did for a living because they were at home most of the time, during the week, fishing and boating with their family and friends. He thought that they were way to young to be retired. One day he had the opportunity to speak with one of the new neighbors. He found out that both of these new neighbors were uaw union officials. He didn't say what local or what company they worked for, but he was blown away that these two men were granted so much free time to play on the water. My friend is a former Ford auto worker himself and was disgusted by this.
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Post by marcus on Jan 28, 2012 21:57:10 GMT -5
Lets use Ford Uaw here. So you guys that dont want to pay unions dues,should people who dont pay still get the same benifits as the ones who do pay? If you dont pay union dues then you should get whatever the company wants to give you.Days off,vacation,pay,bonus etc...
You should not be forced to provide a service for free.
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Post by chaplain on Jan 29, 2012 2:52:09 GMT -5
I agree with you marcus. If you opt out of the union and don't pay your dues, then you should NOT benefit from what the unions have fought for. You should be on your own and negotiate your own benefits with the company. I'll gladly pay my dues.
This post was about Indiana passing the Right To Work bill though. This effects all unions. Not just the uaw.
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Post by wplap on Jan 29, 2012 9:15:38 GMT -5
If the union is worth a damn, then people will not opt out. I don't foresee it being an issue with UAW/Ford.
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Post by trinitus on Jan 29, 2012 10:27:03 GMT -5
This will turn into a double edge sword in my opinion. For one example: Let's say that I stay in the union and you don't. The company may be able to lay me off and keep you, then hire second tier worker's to replace those of us that are layed off. R.T.W. will be the end of unions unless the union can keep a plant a closed shop, otherwise the end will come. For the record, as bad as this union is I would still take my chances with them than not.
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Post by richatktp1 on Jan 30, 2012 2:32:23 GMT -5
I will play the Devils Advocate for a minute. What does the average worker actually get from their union in a typical workday? A "how you doing" from a union rep? A memo? If a worker shows up and works and stays out of trouble, what is the union doing for this worker in reality? If the union protects the bad workers,why do the good workers have to also pay dues?
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Post by marcus on Jan 30, 2012 17:06:30 GMT -5
average worker gets from being in our union 30 an hour vacation sick days profit sharing signing bonus good healthcare sub pay retirement cant be fired just because boss dont like ya on and on I can go.
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Post by marcus on Jan 30, 2012 17:07:31 GMT -5
If the US Gov would let us stop paying tax how many would stop paying tax? How would that work out?
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Post by richatktp1 on Jan 30, 2012 18:40:48 GMT -5
30 an hour- New hires make 1/2 the wage. Fazed out. vacation- the vast majority get vacation pay. sick days-see above answer profit sharing-not a reliable yearly benefit. signing bonus- hush money for NO RAISES for 9 years. good healthcare- Humana gets worse every year. sub pay- only if you are layed off, another once in a while benefit. Retirement- might get it if you live long enough and/or they do not find a way to screw you out of it before you retire. Sounds alot like Social Security. Alot of ifs with that one. cant be fired just because boss dont like ya- A reliable employee doesnt worry about getting fired for nothing. You forgot 401k, NO MATCH with very few funds to choose from. You forgot MANDITORY O.T., most do not work o.t. at their companies every whim. And you forgot UNION DUES, many get the same benefits without paying for protection. The DEVIL is in the details!!!
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Post by ktpelec on Jan 30, 2012 18:59:34 GMT -5
If you don't want to belong to a union, Zappos is always hiring.....LOL
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Post by richatktp1 on Jan 30, 2012 19:17:45 GMT -5
Legal services- Fazed out 2013. The company has been chipping away at the benefits for years. The average pay for production workers in Bullitt county is $19hr. Starting pay at ktp is $15hr.
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Post by ktpelec on Jan 30, 2012 19:58:11 GMT -5
The average pay for production workers in Bullitt county is $19hr. I've never seen that statistic anywhere, are those all non-union or a mix of both? Starting pay at Zappos was $10 an hour. Almost every industry worker, especially manufacturing, have seen losses in wages and benefits. I still believe the union jobs are much more desirable, 17000 people did also, when LAP took applications.
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Post by richatktp1 on Jan 30, 2012 21:10:39 GMT -5
1-24-2012 Courier Journal article about Magna Seating. EXERPT-The average hourly wage for a job in manufacturing in Bullitt County is $19.60, according to federal Bureau of Labor statistics compiled by Uric Dufrene, a professor of economics at Indiana University Southeast.
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Post by fordworker95 on Jan 30, 2012 22:01:31 GMT -5
all the benefits listed here were NOT given or taken by union leadership,THEY=the company would take all benefits away if they could get away with it,latest contracts not that good,but it is because THEY= the company wanted to take even more away,so remember before u bash leadership,they are still fighting for us,not against us,monetary gains and benefits are made on the national level,work rules and such are in local agreements.WE THE RANK AND FILE,will ultimately have to make a stand on the national level to recoup our losses,right to work laws will not change that.
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Post by richatktp1 on Jan 30, 2012 22:34:05 GMT -5
WE THE RANK AND FILE,will ultimately have to make a stand on the national level to recoup our losses,right to work laws will not change that.[/quote]............................................................................................................................... How do the rank and file take a stand on the national level when the negotiators are not rank and file workers? Let me guess, by sending people to the IUAW that care about the little people. Sounds eerily like in politics when people say we change Washington by electing better people. Sounds good!!!
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Post by ktpelec on Jan 31, 2012 6:49:57 GMT -5
Bullitt Co. has been growing in manufacturing businesses, non-union and union. $19 is a long way from the wage union workers make here at Ford.... It's an accepted fact that among manufacturing jobs union employees have the best wages and benefits, setting the bar high for all of the industry. The corporate world will always try to get lower costs attacking those that make the most. Now more than ever unions need support. "Right to Work" is just an attack on workers.
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Post by ScottR@KTP on Jan 31, 2012 9:09:42 GMT -5
You would be correct ktpelec...ask the new hires here at KTP...they would love to make $19 an hour.
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Post by Grimace on Jan 31, 2012 10:17:15 GMT -5
Why do you think the Indiana government officials behind this plan are so worried about "YOU" having to pay union dues? The fact that they are behind it?, tells me that unions do work, and I'll keep paying my dues.
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Post by Jr on Jan 31, 2012 12:33:57 GMT -5
Why do you think the Indiana government officials behind this plan are so worried about "YOU" having to pay union dues? The fact that they are behind it?, tells me that unions do work, and I'll keep paying my dues. Totally Agree!!!!!!
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Post by richatktp1 on Jan 31, 2012 14:36:35 GMT -5
$28.76+$15.00=$43.76/2= $21.88hr Average at Ford is $21.88.(base pay) That is not a long way off from $19hr.
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Post by fordlapworker1993 on Jan 31, 2012 17:20:51 GMT -5
I dont see the big deal with a right to work state. You should be able to choose, NAP was in a rtws and we had a pretty damn good union compared to the sh** hole local I transferred to at DTP where it is not a rtws.
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