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Post by machination on Sept 5, 2018 12:41:10 GMT -5
Ok a person with 94 seniority has their job dissolved,awol coverage guy has 95 seniority,there’s an open job on the team who fills it ?95 or 94 person?Contractually speaking. The team leader bids out the job to his entire team, by seniority, giving the team the opportunity to bid on it until someone takes it. He goes down his seniority list, starting from the top, and asks each person until someone takes it. Then, since THAT persons job will be opening up, he then bids THAT one out in the same manner. This continues until it is all settled. Usually it only takes 2 or 3 cycles. This is the correct procedure and it gives people on the TEAM the only chance of actually moving to another job if their seniority allows.
If an open, or soon to be opening, job is bid out and no one wants it, the LOWEST seniority EXTRA or AWOL COVERAGE person is forced to take it, because you can't displace a primary operator this way, and awol coverage is a job or position on the team, NOT a primary operation. Awol coverage and Extra are essentially synonymous, and they do NOT get to shut out the rest of the team from an open job opportunity.
You're welcome.
PS. On a separate note, the only ways to CORRECTLY displace a primary operator are:
1. Medical placement bumps the person off their job according to the Medical Placement Procedure in the LOCAL agreement. This is permanent. 2. Person has very low DEPARTMENT seniority and gets LOANED OUTSIDE of the department as a result. This is temporary, just for the day or days he's loaned. 3. The job gets combined with another one and the person had fewer job elements than the job he's getting combined with. The person who's job had more elements keeps the combined operation and the person who had fewer becomes EXTRA or AWOL COVERAGE. Seniority does NOT factor into this scenario. This is permanent. 4. There is a Reduction-in-Force on the team and the person has the lowest seniority and gets removed from the team. This, obviously, is permanent. 5. The person is out on medical leave for more than 3 months and falls off of his team's drot, effectively removing him from the team. If he cannot get back on the team, or he can but his team-mates are a bunch of turds who wont let him get his job back, then this is permanent. 6. The person is injured and becomes medically restricted from his job. This is either temporary or permanent depending on his prognosis for recovery.
PPS. If you like, print out this post and tape it up in your area or give it to your team leaders so they'll know the correct method.
PPPS. You're welcome.
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Post by Ex-metalman on Sept 5, 2018 19:11:27 GMT -5
Ok a person with 94 seniority has their job dissolved,awol coverage guy has 95 seniority,there’s an open job on the team who fills it ?95 or 94 person?Contractually speaking. The team leader bids out the job to his entire team, by seniority, giving the team the opportunity to bid on it until someone takes it. He goes down his seniority list, starting from the top, and asks each person until someone takes it. Then, since THAT persons job will be opening up, he then bids THAT one out in the same manner. This continues until it is all settled. Usually it only takes 2 or 3 cycles. This is the correct procedure and it gives people on the TEAM the only chance of actually moving to another job if their seniority allows.
If an open, or soon to be opening, job is bid out and no one wants it, the LOWEST seniority EXTRA or AWOL COVERAGE person is forced to take it, because you can't displace a primary operator this way, and awol coverage is a job or position on the team, NOT a primary operation. Awol coverage and Extra are essentially synonymous, and they do NOT get to shut out the rest of the team from an open job opportunity.
You're welcome.
PS. On a separate note, the only ways to CORRECTLY displace a primary operator are:
1. Medical placement bumps the person off their job according to the Medical Placement Procedure in the LOCAL agreement. This is permanent. 2. Person has very low DEPARTMENT seniority and gets LOANED OUTSIDE of the department as a result. This is temporary, just for the day or days he's loaned. 3. The job gets combined with another one and the person had fewer job elements than the job he's getting combined with. The person who's job had more elements keeps the combined operation and the person who had fewer becomes EXTRA or AWOL COVERAGE. Seniority does NOT factor into this scenario. This is permanent. 4. There is a Reduction-in-Force on the team and the person has the lowest seniority and gets removed from the team. This, obviously, is permanent. 5. The person is out on medical leave for more than 3 months and falls off of his team's drot, effectively removing him from the team. If he cannot get back on the team, or he can but his team-mates are a bunch of turds who wont let him get his job back, then this is permanent. 6. The person is injured and becomes medically restricted from his job. This is either temporary or permanent depending on his prognosis for recovery.
PPS. If you like, print out this post and tape it up in your area or give it to your team leaders so they'll know the correct method.
PPPS. You're welcome.
Ok.You know I believe everything you say .Is there a page in the contract that shows all this info?Mainly the Awol coverage is not a job.Ty machy |
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Post by machination on Sept 5, 2018 21:08:56 GMT -5
The team leader bids out the job to his entire team, by seniority, giving the team the opportunity to bid on it until someone takes it. He goes down his seniority list, starting from the top, and asks each person until someone takes it. Then, since THAT persons job will be opening up, he then bids THAT one out in the same manner. This continues until it is all settled. Usually it only takes 2 or 3 cycles. This is the correct procedure and it gives people on the TEAM the only chance of actually moving to another job if their seniority allows.
If an open, or soon to be opening, job is bid out and no one wants it, the LOWEST seniority EXTRA or AWOL COVERAGE person is forced to take it, because you can't displace a primary operator this way, and awol coverage is a job or position on the team, NOT a primary operation. Awol coverage and Extra are essentially synonymous, and they do NOT get to shut out the rest of the team from an open job opportunity.
You're welcome.
PS. On a separate note, the only ways to CORRECTLY displace a primary operator are:
1. Medical placement bumps the person off their job according to the Medical Placement Procedure in the LOCAL agreement. This is permanent. 2. Person has very low DEPARTMENT seniority and gets LOANED OUTSIDE of the department as a result. This is temporary, just for the day or days he's loaned. 3. The job gets combined with another one and the person had fewer job elements than the job he's getting combined with. The person who's job had more elements keeps the combined operation and the person who had fewer becomes EXTRA or AWOL COVERAGE. Seniority does NOT factor into this scenario. This is permanent. 4. There is a Reduction-in-Force on the team and the person has the lowest seniority and gets removed from the team. This, obviously, is permanent. 5. The person is out on medical leave for more than 3 months and falls off of his team's drot, effectively removing him from the team. If he cannot get back on the team, or he can but his team-mates are a bunch of turds who wont let him get his job back, then this is permanent. 6. The person is injured and becomes medically restricted from his job. This is either temporary or permanent depending on his prognosis for recovery.
PPS. If you like, print out this post and tape it up in your area or give it to your team leaders so they'll know the correct method.
PPPS. You're welcome.
Ok.You know I believe everything you say .Is there a page in the contract that shows all this info?Mainly the Awol coverage is not a job.Ty machy Negative. It's a matter of long standing convention which is based around seniority. Now the exceptions for medical placements and reductions in force, loans and so on, are contractual, but bidding of the team jobs has been convention since the first MOA. Convention means the way it's done and has always been done in the absence of legislative language. It carries as much weight. Every single thing doesn't have to be legislated. The old guys knew this. I'm a team leader with balls so I carry on the traditions for fairness of my people. If another team leader doesn't do it this way, he's violating convention and has no balls. Sorry. Conventional practices carry weight. True conventional practices, not some bullshit. It is SO important to have a team leader who truly understands convention, the contract, and ethics and fairness for his team, and is impartial. I have friends on my team, but the team comes first. Friendships can fall before I'll wrong my team. Team Leader has a sacred responsibility to his brothers and sisters. You can't please everyone. Some will hate you, some will love you. But do it right and fair without regard to popularity, or gtfo. |
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Post by hawk0308 on Sept 6, 2018 2:13:24 GMT -5
Ok.You know I believe everything you say .Is there a page in the contract that shows all this info?Mainly the Awol coverage is not a job.Ty machy Negative. It's a matter of long standing convention which is based around seniority. Now the exceptions for medical placements and reductions in force, loans and so on, are contractual, but bidding of the team jobs has been convention since the first MOA. Convention means the way it's done and has always been done in the absence of legislative language. It carries as much weight. Every single thing doesn't have to be legislated. The old guys knew this. I'm a team leader with balls so I carry on the traditions for fairness of my people. If another team leader doesn't do it this way, he's violating convention and has no balls. Sorry. Conventional practices carry weight. True conventional practices, not some bullshit. It is SO important to have a team leader who truly understands convention, the contract, and ethics and fairness for his team, and is impartial. I have friends on my team, but the team comes first. Friendships can fall before I'll wrong my team. Team Leader has a sacred responsibility to his brothers and sisters. You can't please everyone. Some will hate you, some will love you. But do it right and fair without regard to popularity, or gtfo. I watched this thread for a minute.... Convention?  See.... this is the "BEST" thing FOMOCO ever did....pit team against team...(example...team next 2 you does "flip list different than u/loan list/fill jobs list/whatever...) There is nothing set in stone on how 2 do these and it pits us against each other! #1....IMO should be SENIORITY!!!!(NO QUESTIONS ASKED) #2 AWOL COVERAGE IS A JOB....(any company "matrix" I've seen/looked at....AWOL coverage is a job (and if not seen that way...the "TREE HOUSE/UNION SUPERIORS FAULT) #3 it's not that hard/use your head inside these 4 walls....I only have 23 years in and we only have each other 2 count on...I would NEVER GO against SENIORITY but the elimination of a job would not...(IMO) knock a lesser SENIORITY guy off a job. (AWOL INCLUDED....as long as it was not a reduction in the team.....then a different story) |
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Post by machination on Sept 6, 2018 10:41:02 GMT -5
Negative. It's a matter of long standing convention which is based around seniority. Now the exceptions for medical placements and reductions in force, loans and so on, are contractual, but bidding of the team jobs has been convention since the first MOA. Convention means the way it's done and has always been done in the absence of legislative language. It carries as much weight. Every single thing doesn't have to be legislated. The old guys knew this. I'm a team leader with balls so I carry on the traditions for fairness of my people. If another team leader doesn't do it this way, he's violating convention and has no balls. Sorry. Conventional practices carry weight. True conventional practices, not some bullshit. It is SO important to have a team leader who truly understands convention, the contract, and ethics and fairness for his team, and is impartial. I have friends on my team, but the team comes first. Friendships can fall before I'll wrong my team. Team Leader has a sacred responsibility to his brothers and sisters. You can't please everyone. Some will hate you, some will love you. But do it right and fair without regard to popularity, or gtfo. I watched this thread for a minute.... Convention? See.... this is the "BEST" thing FOMOCO ever did....pit team against team...(example...team next 2 you does "flip list different than u/loan list/fill jobs list/whatever...) There is nothing set in stone on how 2 do these and it pits us against each other! #1....IMO should be SENIORITY!!!!(NO QUESTIONS ASKED) #2 AWOL COVERAGE IS A JOB....(any company "matrix" I've seen/looked at....AWOL coverage is a job (and if not seen that way...the "TREE HOUSE/UNION SUPERIORS FAULT) #3 it's not that hard/use your head inside these 4 walls....I only have 23 years in and we only have each other 2 count on...I would NEVER GO against SENIORITY but the elimination of a job would not...(IMO) knock a lesser SENIORITY guy off a job. (AWOL INCLUDED....as long as it was not a reduction in the team.....then a different story) Know why you can walk if your light is on 40 minutes and no one relieves you for the restroom? Convention. Know why your extra break time is on the end if they break for 10 but up it to 10.7 due to breakdowns? Convention. Yea it's an actual thing and people who've read the contract understand it, because it's not in there but is still expected and is how things have always been done. |
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Post by machination on Sept 6, 2018 11:09:49 GMT -5
The team leader bids out the job to his entire team, by seniority, giving the team the opportunity to bid on it until someone takes it. He goes down his seniority list, starting from the top, and asks each person until someone takes it. Then, since THAT persons job will be opening up, he then bids THAT one out in the same manner. This continues until it is all settled. Usually it only takes 2 or 3 cycles. This is the correct procedure and it gives people on the TEAM the only chance of actually moving to another job if their seniority allows.
If an open, or soon to be opening, job is bid out and no one wants it, the LOWEST seniority EXTRA or AWOL COVERAGE person is forced to take it, because you can't displace a primary operator this way, and awol coverage is a job or position on the team, NOT a primary operation. Awol coverage and Extra are essentially synonymous, and they do NOT get to shut out the rest of the team from an open job opportunity.
You're welcome.
PS. On a separate note, the only ways to CORRECTLY displace a primary operator are:
1. Medical placement bumps the person off their job according to the Medical Placement Procedure in the LOCAL agreement. This is permanent. 2. Person has very low DEPARTMENT seniority and gets LOANED OUTSIDE of the department as a result. This is temporary, just for the day or days he's loaned. 3. The job gets combined with another one and the person had fewer job elements than the job he's getting combined with. The person who's job had more elements keeps the combined operation and the person who had fewer becomes EXTRA or AWOL COVERAGE. Seniority does NOT factor into this scenario. This is permanent. 4. There is a Reduction-in-Force on the team and the person has the lowest seniority and gets removed from the team. This, obviously, is permanent. 5. The person is out on medical leave for more than 3 months and falls off of his team's drot, effectively removing him from the team. If he cannot get back on the team, or he can but his team-mates are a bunch of turds who wont let him get his job back, then this is permanent. 6. The person is injured and becomes medically restricted from his job. This is either temporary or permanent depending on his prognosis for recovery.
PPS. If you like, print out this post and tape it up in your area or give it to your team leaders so they'll know the correct method.
PPPS. You're welcome.
Ok.You know I believe everything you say .Is there a page in the contract that shows all this info?Mainly the Awol coverage is not a job.Ty machy Oh and I missed part of your question. I stated in my first post that Awol coverage IS a job, but it is NOT a primary operation. |
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Post by Ex-metalman on Sept 6, 2018 14:26:21 GMT -5
Ok.You know I believe everything you say .Is there a page in the contract that shows all this info?Mainly the Awol coverage is not a job.Ty machy Oh and I missed part of your question. I stated in my first post that Awol coverage IS a job, but it is NOT a primary operation. So you can get “bumped” off a job???never hurt that one? |
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Post by Ex-metalman on Sept 6, 2018 14:27:50 GMT -5
I watched this thread for a minute.... Convention? See.... this is the "BEST" thing FOMOCO ever did....pit team against team...(example...team next 2 you does "flip list different than u/loan list/fill jobs list/whatever...) There is nothing set in stone on how 2 do these and it pits us against each other! #1....IMO should be SENIORITY!!!!(NO QUESTIONS ASKED) #2 AWOL COVERAGE IS A JOB....(any company "matrix" I've seen/looked at....AWOL coverage is a job (and if not seen that way...the "TREE HOUSE/UNION SUPERIORS FAULT) #3 it's not that hard/use your head inside these 4 walls....I only have 23 years in and we only have each other 2 count on...I would NEVER GO against SENIORITY but the elimination of a job would not...(IMO) knock a lesser SENIORITY guy off a job. (AWOL INCLUDED....as long as it was not a reduction in the team.....then a different story) Know why you can walk if your light is on 40 minutes and no one relieves you for the restroom? Convention. Know why your extra break time is on the end if they break for 10 but up it to 10.7 due to breakdowns? Convention. Yea it's an actual thing and people who've read the contract understand it, because it's not in there but is still expected and is how things have always been done. 40 min thing is total bullshit.Timbers told me years ago.I still go when I want.Would you wait 40 mins to shit your pants??Machy may not me.. |
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Post by machination on Sept 6, 2018 16:22:50 GMT -5
Know why you can walk if your light is on 40 minutes and no one relieves you for the restroom? Convention. Know why your extra break time is on the end if they break for 10 but up it to 10.7 due to breakdowns? Convention. Yea it's an actual thing and people who've read the contract understand it, because it's not in there but is still expected and is how things have always been done. 40 min thing is total bullshit.Timbers told me years ago.I still go when I want.Would you wait 40 mins to shit your pants??Machy may not me.. Try just abandoning the line at the drop of a hat whenever "you want" and let me know how that works out for you. Sorry, I thought for a minute you guys wanted answers, but it looks like you'd all still rather have more belief in your own bullshit. Nothing's changed lol Better yet, since you guys don't comprehend convention and have had your eyes closed for 20+ years, which is why so many of you don't know shit about how anything works, let's just let management place people wherever they want to when there are open jobs. Why not? The contract doesn't say they can't, and you guys don't like "convention" which is what gives the team the right to work out its internal affairs. Lol you guys are retarded 😂😂😂 |
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Post by Ex-metalman on Sept 6, 2018 19:13:55 GMT -5
40 min thing is total bullshit.Timbers told me years ago.I still go when I want.Would you wait 40 mins to shit your pants??Machy may not me.. Try just abandoning the line at the drop of a hat whenever "you want" and let me know how that works out for you. Sorry, I thought for a minute you guys wanted answers, but it looks like you'd all still rather have more belief in your own bullshit. Nothing's changed lol Better yet, since you guys don't comprehend convention and have had your eyes closed for 20+ years, which is why so many of you don't know shit about how anything works, let's just let management place people wherever they want to when there are open jobs. Why not? The contract doesn't say they can't, and you guys don't like "convention" which is what gives the team the right to work out its internal affairs. Lol you guys are retarded 😂😂😂 I guarantee I will /have “abandoned “ the line several times.You let a supervisor tell me I can’t leave and I shit my pants?LAWSUIT..Youve been sitting behind a desk too long.Forgot how it really works.We run this shithole not the Co..I see crazy shit daily with these new people.You must not.SDMF |
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Post by machination on Sept 11, 2018 13:01:18 GMT -5
Try just abandoning the line at the drop of a hat whenever "you want" and let me know how that works out for you. Sorry, I thought for a minute you guys wanted answers, but it looks like you'd all still rather have more belief in your own bullshit. Nothing's changed lol Better yet, since you guys don't comprehend convention and have had your eyes closed for 20+ years, which is why so many of you don't know shit about how anything works, let's just let management place people wherever they want to when there are open jobs. Why not? The contract doesn't say they can't, and you guys don't like "convention" which is what gives the team the right to work out its internal affairs. Lol you guys are retarded 😂😂😂 I guarantee I will /have “abandoned “ the line several times.You let a supervisor tell me I can’t leave and I shit my pants?LAWSUIT..Youve been sitting behind a desk too long.Forgot how it really works.We run this shithole not the Co..I see crazy shit daily with these new people.You must not.SDMF  |
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Post by Ex-metalman on Sept 11, 2018 13:45:10 GMT -5
I guarantee I will /have “abandoned “ the line several times.You let a supervisor tell me I can’t leave and I shit my pants?LAWSUIT..Youve been sitting behind a desk too long.Forgot how it really works.We run this shithole not the Co..I see crazy shit daily with these new people.You must not.SDMF Yep..All True..Drink all ya want.Still comes down to,Co can’t do shit to anyone in here for leaving the line to shit..👍🏿 |
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