Team Leader bid or vote?

[ScottR@KTP]

Here's a twist...should team leaders be voted in by the team, bid on within the team, or bid using the plant wide bid system?

[ScottR@KTP]

After some thought, I believe the position should be bid on within the team the same way an open job is filled within a team.

[bryanv]

1 yr team vote. worked the best. I have been lucky to have the same team leader that does a great job for the past 7-8yrs.

[lilbear]

I actually like the current system at KTP. my reasoning is if you have a bad one you can vote him out!!!don't have to go through the whole disqualification process. you get someone in there Thur a bid and they could lay down on team suck up to management and your stuck!!! management won't disqualify one of there own. for all the LAP'ERS I'm sure some remember the upgrader who wouldn't move for sh!t!! don't get me wrong there were some good ones. but if you weren't so lucky to have one you were stuck, till he or she retired or bid out. just my take on subject

[meanjean]

Vote!!!! ESPECIALLY team leaders. Lilbear is right, because if it is a bid job, you can't get rid of them if they suck or lay down on you. I am all about seniority, but if a senior person is taking a job to have things easier and not do the job they are supposed to do, then the whole team is screwed. I have been in that situation. Certain people were taken care of and the rest got the shaft. It sucked to say the least.

[driveshaftgrunt]

Trust me on this, or anyone else that hired in on CLT in 1993.


You DO NOT want team leaders that aren't answerable to the team.


You will get the following:

--A guy just trying to get his last year in before retiring who will do as little as possible.

--The biggest suck-ass you've ever seen with his first opportunity to actually use his ass-sucking ability to get himself somewhere.

--Or a guy/gal with NO motivation to do anything for anybody whatsoever............

Trust us on this, most of us have seen it.

[marcus]

plant wide bid is what id like.

[tiger66]

If you get a bad T.L. You can vote him or her out. Def. Vote on it

[marcus]

We should just vote on all jobs in the plant,incase we get a bad worker we can vote him out.

[ScottR@KTP]

Marcus has a point...why have any bids with the way most feel about the TL position? Seniority should not mean anything using your way of thinking. People believe you can just vote out a TL...but you have to give him 2 years before you can even hold another vote. If you want it prior to the 2 year period, you really need to read the steps in the 'little blue book' of contract highlights. If the TL is up the boss' ass, you have no way of getting rid of him. If he's buddies with the union, you're screwed even more. Having to go to the union, management, and then labor to remove one is ridiculous. If it was a true 'majority' of the team's wishes, a vote could be had anytime a 'majority' want the current TL out. If the majority of the team want a new TL, there should be a vote, plain and simple. I have had some good TLs, but I've had more that a majority wanted out, but their 2 years was not up yet.

[lilbear]

I believe the TL should stay the same. Now the rest of the jobs should be bid jobs. It blows my mind that you hire in on a job and are stuck. All those jobs, for example the drivers in MOD CENTER, should be bid. Don't give me bullsh!@ excuse they are temporary jobs. Those people have been out there since FEB? Getting OT and most are low seniority or medical placement. Where's the guy who bust his A#@ for 10-15yrs on frame line suppose to go. Twice the people as LAP, HALF the bid jobs. That was right on point Scott!!!

[ktp399]

The problem with some of the bid jobs are that they are taken by medicals. It seems like every week you see someone on medical walking around looking for a job. It just blows my mind that they walk around, but when the weekend comes, it's a different story.

[trinitus]

I will give my take on this, I have always thought this position should have been a plant wide BID. Yes you may get a bad one but you know what even when you vote one in they could be bad and as long as they take care of 51% of the team they will stay in.

I did vote no on the contract but not because they wanted to make TL's a bid job as much as they wanted to Grandfather the ones doing the jobs at the time in there. That was wrong then and it is wrong now. Eskridge, Kess, Hughes and Janes man-up and do a plant bid for those jobs and quit trying to take care of your buddies. If the person who gets it can't handle it tough shit. They can either man-up or get DQed.

[marcus]

They tell us this was voted on but Fall to tell us the details on it.Thanks for the post trinitus NO GRAND FATHER INs.

[marcus]

We need more bid jobs period,its just going to equal way more medicals.

[watchmen]

Aug 19, 2010 14:20:18 GMT -5 trinitus said:

I will give my take on this, I have always thought this position should have been a plant wide BID. Yes you may get a bad one but you know what even when you vote one in they could be bad and as long as they take care of 51% of the team they will stay in.

I did vote no on the contract but not because they wanted to make TL's a bid job as much as they wanted to Grandfather the ones doing the jobs at the time in there. That was wrong then and it is wrong now. Eskridge, Kess, Hughes and Janes man-up and do a plant bid for those jobs and quit trying to take care of your buddies. If the person who gets it can't handle it tough shit. They can either man-up or get DQed.

I have been a Team Leader for almost 10yrs and wish, i mean wish the Team Leader position would be Grand Fathered in for i dont have enough seniority to get it thru a bid. I voted yes the last vote to do it.

There is nothing more than i love than walking around doing nothing, going to bathroom when i want, sitting in the bosses air condition office, getting those UAW catered lunches in the Team Leader lounge while all of those with all that seniority that came over from LAP sweat their asses off on overloaded jobs getting R@Ws. I love telling the bosses over a cold beer that you have plenty of time on your job to do more work.

PLEASE GRANDFATHER ME IN TO TEAM LEADER!!!!!!!! ITS SUCH A GREAT GREAT JOB!!!!!!!

[TonyV]

That's some funny shit watchmen! LMAO!!!!

All joking aside - The team leader debate will never be agreed upon. I would like to see the paint dept., body shop, and other desirable areas put many more positions up for bid instead of appointing or having teams bid amongst themselves. The final area, cal-line, repairs, etc. should all be bid out.

As for the team leader gig, here's my thought:

Up for bid- Team leader - (Come in early to unlock cabinets and distribute tooling on your own dime, get ripped on a daily basis by your own team mates that never agree on anything, chase down repairs in-between constant restroom calls, pressured by management to add to jobs so they do not have to think for themselves, deal with off day requests with more ripping from your team mates, get stuck on jobs because management needs numbers to balance, use your own breaks for organization, get threatened to be voted out every other week while balancing egos on your team)

Sounds like the perfect job......................still laughing............

[marcus]

I hear ya tony,my team leader starts pee breaks at 6.50 and ends right at 9.Then starts over at 10

[kessinger]

I can tell you how this vote will go, about 96% against. Thats how they shot down my first run at a local lol. The only thing that even changed in the contract was removing the TL bid and it got voted in without THAT, by over 80% I believe.

Marcus, We were very open about the TL's being grandfathered in, it was no secret by any means, we handed out the exact contract language, even though it hit the trash before most people even read it.

Almost any job that gets turned into a bid will have the current people grandfathered in, then plant wide bid after that.

Why you ask?

Well, the company will never agree to do it otherwise( they get some say so in contracts to). They are not going to agree to put 200 TL bids up and know they are going to have to train them all on 14 jobs.

Here is the math on that: 200 TL x 14 jobs x 24 hours (3 days training average) x $30 (for easy math) =2,016,000. That is 2 MILLION DOLLARS they would have to spend to do it that way, trust me they won't agree to that, WE TRIED. IF... I repeat IF, I could make em spend 2 million dollars, air conditioning comes before TL bids, and that's not gonna happen either.

It was setup for them to be plant wide every time it was bid after it started.

For the record I WILL NEVER TRY TO BID TEAM LEADERS AGAIN, VOTE ME OUT IF THAT IS YOUR ISSUE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! No one even read the contract, they heard about TL's being bid and refused to even look at the rest.


lilbear, why have you not mentioned to ME that the MOD bothers you so much? I have seen you in the office, so I'm just wondering? Rest assured if I ever feel you are doing things wrong, or disagree with what you did I will extend that courtesy to you, not post on it prior to doing so.

The MOD jobs aren't staying, I am not going to bid 40 jobs just to remove the people that are already on those bids in Oct. I don't feel that is right, just because the company can't figure out what they are doing. The company is at fault, I'm not going to punish the current drivers for that. The extra 25 mile drives have made our quality during this launch TONS better, I also don't want to sacrifice that. Bidding them now would result in up to 40 current inspectors being reduced even though they bid on their jobs properly and that many day shift inspectors could be rolled to nights just because Ford can't get their shit straight. Sorry, I don't believe union members should pay the price for managements ignorance anymore than they already do.

We still have to follow the contractual OT language, even if someone is medical or temporarily doing a job. I'm not going to ignore the contract just to score easy votes.

Where do you guys get that we have sooo few bid jobs? As far as that goes almost all jobs ARE bid since that is how most teams do it. Guess I am going to have to research this and hand out a little reality. hehe.

trinitus, Man up? I man up and stand behind EVERYTHING I do, or decision I make. I do it here a few times a week with my name clearly here for all to read.

watchmen, thank goodness your imaginary team can vote you out next time, if you were bid they couldn't. You would be able to laugh over that beer with your supervisor while he said "your team wants me to write you up, YEA RIGHT". Man that would be quite the knee slapper for you two wouldn't it.

A vast majority (not all) of our current team leaders do a damned good job and get very little in return for it.

[Wolverine]

True, could not have said it better myself. Voting is the system we have now. So people please don't forget we are all eligible to run for T-leader, if that is really what you want.