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Post by kessinger on Jan 26, 2011 20:55:48 GMT -5
Brundog, I have no clue who you are, so I can't fake you out and send you just because you posted this. So go ask him to go to a show. See what happens. But remember its not an every day occurance, he can't send everyone.
If you believe we do things for purely political reasons, then sending lots of random people is the politicly smart thing to do right? Since you would be securing a vote from someone you don't know well. Why send someone that already supports you?
No offense snoop. But everyone builds our trucks, so everyone has put a lot of time in prepping a vehicle by building it. I don't see that anyone has a claim to be the "one" that had that vehicle ready for the show. Again if you wanna go, ask someone.
You can't complain about other people getting to go to an autoshow if you never asked anyone to go.
As to asking Toyota to unionize, it is needed, it helps us with bargaining. If toyota pays 8 dollars an hour we cant get paid what we do and survive.
As to us buying them. You still can't park a GM or Dodge in the normal lots and they have been UAW for years. I see it as no different. I want them to be union so more Americans can have good jobs. I still buy one.
You can complain about the Toyota, he wasn't happy with that either.
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Post by tiger66 on Jan 26, 2011 21:01:07 GMT -5
Don't whore yourself for money!! My last post on this subject.
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Post by brundog2020 on Jan 26, 2011 21:57:02 GMT -5
Kess,my name's Steve bruner.I've been upstairs to see u over overtime issues in body!I'm from LAP and i admit i'm lost when it comes to your local contract and the rules you all go by,even though i don't agree with alot of the explanations as to why things are done the way they are,you've always explained them in a straight up fashion!I've got 23yrs in and i can tell you that politics play into appointments and who goes to what,LAP was the same way as far as that goes,thats not to say that some new faces get the opportunity but it's still the good old boy network and even though i may be new at this plant, i've heard enough from the guys that are from this plant about the way things are done to know that doesn't matter which plant your at it's still who you know!!!
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Post by ragtop69 on Jan 26, 2011 22:39:01 GMT -5
I went to the Chicago auto show in '95. I was a great experience and I wish everyone that wants to represent the company could go. I drive my ford to work but I have a non ford at home I drive in the summer. It's a mercury cougar !!!!!!!
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Post by kessinger on Jan 27, 2011 0:45:49 GMT -5
Steve, rereading my post it does sound like I claim that never happens. You are correct. Some people that go are sent because they are involved or go to alot of union meetings. Yes that does play a part.
But, he has made an effort to get outside that and send people that normaly wouldn't ever get to go some where like that. And that was what he was doing here. And it kinda backfired on him since he didn't know the person well enough to know what vehicle they drove.
When LAP first came over he sent a few LAP guys that got elected team leader to shows, even though he didn't know them very well at the time. When the hot rod nationals came he sent two repair guys that one time showed him pics of the cars they restored.
So yea, politics will always play some part, no doubt. But, it should not be the end all be all factor. And if have interest in something like that, ask him sometime.
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Post by richatktp1 on Jan 27, 2011 1:05:05 GMT -5
Tiger66, PENN and TELLER have a show called bullsh*t. Check out the episode on UNIONS. Just follow the money.
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Post by buckeyeinky on Jan 27, 2011 7:06:52 GMT -5
like MARCUS said , tiger, if you dont get it then no way anyone here can explain it 2 you.
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Post by Freebird on Jan 27, 2011 7:38:30 GMT -5
The person parking a Hummer at one of the gates is a tradesman. I don't have a problem with that. It is an american - union built vehicle as for all this asian garbage (which all conveniently come with handicap parking permits) I would love to take a hammer and keys and go to town if itr weren't for fear of incarceration and loss of employment!!! ;D
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Post by lappainter on Jan 27, 2011 8:10:08 GMT -5
I'm wondering if she spent more time promoting the Ford brand or shopping for a future Toyota at their display? What gets me about Ford employees buying Union competition, is they are biting the hand that feeds all of us. I personally love to see more Asian automakers become unionized to strengthening our bargaining tools. But I still wouldn't buy what's not written at the top of my pay stub.
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snoop
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Post by snoop on Jan 27, 2011 8:23:50 GMT -5
kess, i'm talking about people that spend hours working on the jobs, and for your info I kno for a fact the workers in body have asked (union Reps) about going an nothing ever comes of it. like always if you don't kno anybody you don't get asked to go. Its the same o' same o.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2011 9:40:01 GMT -5
as for all this asian garbage (which all conveniently come with handicap parking permits) I would love to take a hammer and keys and go to town if itr weren't for fear of incarceration and loss of employment!!! ;D People wear tool belts or sometimes even have their key rings protruding out of their pockets, and sometimes these things can accidentally scratch the finish on a car. Just sayin  |
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Post by marcus on Jan 27, 2011 9:50:55 GMT -5
Great post Kess,tiger66 just doesnt understand or get it.
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Post by Freebird on Jan 27, 2011 9:53:33 GMT -5
as for all this asian garbage (which all conveniently come with handicap parking permits) I would love to take a hammer and keys and go to town if itr weren't for fear of incarceration and loss of employment!!! ;D People wear tool belts or sometimes even have their key rings protruding out of their pockets, and sometimes these things can accidentally scratch the finish on a car. Just sayin Not sure if it is still happening but we did have a guard using her mothers handicap permit to park her Kia near security. The same guard that's out putting stickers on employees cars for various violations. |
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Post by Freebird on Jan 27, 2011 9:59:23 GMT -5
I really hate to bring this in but there were some union made Toyotas out of California. Don't know if her's was one just sayin. You know what screw her and her effing Toyota. ;D
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Post by driveshaftgrunt on Jan 27, 2011 12:06:49 GMT -5
If you're going to work at a Ford/UAW plant and drive a new Toyota and then have the NERVE to ask to participate in ANYTHING, you deserve to have your name posted on this forum.
If you can do something like that without any qualms, then you deserve the all the crap people can throw at you.
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Post by ktpgal89 on Jan 27, 2011 12:34:45 GMT -5
If you're going to work at a Ford/UAW plant and drive a new Toyota and then have the NERVE to ask to participate in ANYTHING, you deserve to have your name posted on this forum. If you can do something like that without any qualms, then you deserve the all the crap people can throw at you. VERY well stated!!! |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2011 13:17:02 GMT -5
If you're going to work at a Ford/UAW plant and drive a new Toyota and then have the NERVE to ask to participate in ANYTHING, you deserve to have your name posted on this forum. If you can do something like that without any qualms, then you deserve the all the crap people can throw at you. I can agree with that. |
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Post by wplap on Jan 27, 2011 13:30:51 GMT -5
Okay! I'll play Devil's Advocate! Who really gives a flying shit what anybody drives? These people punch the clock at this god forsaken dungeon, and I can -at least- respect that. Everyone on here is soooo fucking concerned with "representing" Ford properly....well...think about how Ford represents you. I have read too many posts and comments bashing this place, yet every asshole with two legs wants to be the Ford Poster Child when it comes to getting special privileges. Ford would replace all of us with robots, and one day they will, so be careful taking up arms for representing a giant corporation, which would just as likely kick your ass out onto the street for BOOing or singing. And a side note of my rationale: Ford pays us money for our work, so why give the company back that money by buying one of their vehicles? If you want a Ford...buy a Ford. If you want a boat...buy a boat. If you want gonorrhea...sleep with a Ford employee. I have owned many Fords and have been completely satisfied with their durability and quality, but I don't speak for everyone. Everyone has a nightmare story about any number of brands and they simply don't want to go back down that path of frustration. I, personally, do not put my pride in brand names, I put my pride in myself and my actions, because I know where they come from and what my intentions are. Can you really be proud of shooting screws and popping in plastic trim pieces? It's just what we do, begrudgingly, so that we can buy stupid shit that we really don't need anyway. Someone driving a Toyota does not make them an asshole. Judging someone for driving a different car than you, makes you an asshole. I would like to demand that all motorcycles be parked really far away since none of them are Ford and those fucking things only have two wheels! I mean, really! What's the deal with these people? Too good to drive a Ford?  Yet you still get to park close to the gate! Goddammit! |
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Post by driveshaftgrunt on Jan 27, 2011 14:02:15 GMT -5
The question is more a matter of:
How can someone go represent the Union and a union made company at a trade show, while spending money on a car from a company that's doing everything in their power to weaken and ultimately destroy the UAW.
The Japanese and Korean plants in the US are going to do more to drive down our wages and bennies than any politician or American CEO................and you have the balls to drive their cars, then go to a UAW/Ford booth to 'represent' us..........
Yes, buy what you want, but don't bitch when you get rightly ostracized (which won't happen like it should), your shit gets keyed, or your pay stays stagnant for a decade.
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Post by merepeasant on Jan 27, 2011 14:41:00 GMT -5
Is this about what folks drive or how they are selected? Should folks be selected by how many Fords they own , or have owned? Or by only the Fords that are owned that are assembled in the U.S.? Is this a secret lottery? And how does an employee get to work on the trucks that are going up to the show? Do employees know when a truck rolls down the line that it is destined for the car show and if so do only high seniorty get to assemble it?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2011 16:01:53 GMT -5
Is this about what folks drive or how they are selected? Should folks be selected by how many Fords they own , or have owned? Or by only the Fords that are owned that are assembled in the U.S.? Is this a secret lottery? And how does an employee get to work on the trucks that are going up to the show? Do employees know when a truck rolls down the line that it is destined for the car show and if so do only high seniorty get to assemble it? So, how was Detroit? |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2011 16:11:31 GMT -5
Okay! I'll play Devil's Advocate! Who really gives a flying shit what anybody drives? These people punch the clock at this god forsaken dungeon, and I can -at least- respect that. Everyone on here is soooo fucking concerned with "representing" Ford properly....well...think about how Ford represents you. I have read too many posts and comments bashing this place, yet every asshole with two legs wants to be the Ford Poster Child when it comes to getting special privileges. Ford would replace all of us with robots, and one day they will, so be careful taking up arms for representing a giant corporation, which would just as likely kick your ass out onto the street for BOOing or singing. And a side note of my rationale: Ford pays us money for our work, so why give the company back that money by buying one of their vehicles? If you want a Ford...buy a Ford. If you want a boat...buy a boat. If you want gonorrhea...sleep with a Ford employee. I have owned many Fords and have been completely satisfied with their durability and quality, but I don't speak for everyone. Everyone has a nightmare story about any number of brands and they simply don't want to go back down that path of frustration. I, personally, do not put my pride in brand names, I put my pride in myself and my actions, because I know where they come from and what my intentions are. Can you really be proud of shooting screws and popping in plastic trim pieces? It's just what we do, begrudgingly, so that we can buy stupid shit that we really don't need anyway. Someone driving a Toyota does not make them an asshole. Judging someone for driving a different car than you, makes you an asshole. I would like to demand that all motorcycles be parked really far away since none of them are Ford and those fucking things only have two wheels! I mean, really! What's the deal with these people? Too good to drive a Ford? Yet you still get to park close to the gate! Goddammit! I have yet to work a job where the employer came out on the floor and blew me because I work in a shit hole. I know a Dr. that hates his fucking job because he has to deal with the public every day. I have a good friend that works for a local beer distributor that tells its employees that if they are caught drinking the competitions products, they will be shit canned. Spare the dramatic BS. We all know if we slit our own throats we will die. And by buying the competitors products that just shoves the giant dildo of doom even farther up our asses. I dont agree 100% with the UAW on their decisions, BUT I do agree about buying what you make for a living. If my neighbor seen me pull up in my driveway in a god-damned Toyota and he knows I work at Ford, that just tells him that I think Ford is shit. And that shit trickles down the grapevine like VD at your family reunion. If you dont like Ford, fucking quit! Go to work for Toyota and lick the sweat off their balls. My job may not be my dream job, but its better then anything else thats out there. |
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Post by ktpgal89 on Jan 27, 2011 16:12:24 GMT -5
Is this about what folks drive or how they are selected? Should folks be selected by how many Fords they own , or have owned? Or by only the Fords that are owned that are assembled in the U.S.? Is this a secret lottery? And how does an employee get to work on the trucks that are going up to the show? Do employees know when a truck rolls down the line that it is destined for the car show and if so do only high seniorty get to assemble it? So, how was Detrioit? LOL Good call!!!  |
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Post by ktpgal89 on Jan 27, 2011 16:31:05 GMT -5
I don't understand what a big deal it is for people's names to be kept secret..anytime a UAW member is allowed to attend functions representing Local 862, it should be public record so to speak...am I wrong to think this way?
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Post by merepeasant on Jan 27, 2011 18:21:41 GMT -5
Is this about what folks drive or how they are selected? Should folks be selected by how many Fords they own , or have owned? Or by only the Fords that are owned that are assembled in the U.S.? Is this a secret lottery? And how does an employee get to work on the trucks that are going up to the show? Do employees know when a truck rolls down the line that it is destined for the car show and if so do only high seniorty get to assemble it? So, how was Detroit? Windy- blew up my skirt! Thanks for asking! |
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Post by merepeasant on Jan 27, 2011 18:26:57 GMT -5
I'll have what wplap is drivin.
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Post by wplap on Jan 27, 2011 18:28:33 GMT -5
Analspasm? Damn right!
Like I said...I am just playing Devil's Advocate because no one was representing those other fucks.
Yes. I would love to be able to quit Ford, but the stupid fucking lottery doesn't see it the same way.
Why work at Toyota? It's the same mindless, mundane work we do at Ford....but they do it with more recalls! (That was nice to say for once.)
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Post by sickofit on Jan 28, 2011 1:03:26 GMT -5
The person parking a Hummer at one of the gates is a tradesman. I don't have a problem with that. It is an american - union built vehicle as for all this asian garbage (which all conveniently come with handicap parking permits) I would love to take a hammer and keys and go to town if itr weren't for fear of incarceration and loss of employment!!! ;D So, you are ok with not following the rules. Rules are only Ford products are allowed at any gate. All others are to be parked at gate zero. UNLESS you are handicapped and have a permit. The motorcycle excemption is bullshit. It is a motor vehicle. Way too many elected and appointed drive them, that is why they are exempt. Now if you are handicapped and have a permit then all is good. |
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Post by sickofit on Jan 28, 2011 1:27:56 GMT -5
If you're going to work at a Ford/UAW plant and drive a new Toyota and then have the NERVE to ask to participate in ANYTHING, you deserve to have your name posted on this forum. If you can do something like that without any qualms, then you deserve the all the crap people can throw at you. Do you feel the same way about the brothers and sisters driving non Ford products parking at gate zero? Do you feel the same about the brothers or sisters driving motorcycles (non Ford) representing our products? You see I could care less what you drive or do. I drive and own all Ford products. I do this for me. Last I checked we live in a free country, you can do, buy, come, go, drive, speak, and live how the he'll you want to. No one needs anyones approval or needs to ask someone if it's ok to buy what they want. Ford hired you me and everyone else in this plant. The union was never at any of mine or yours interview. When you and I applied to work at Ford did the union or Ford hire you? That's right Ford did. The union forces us to pay union dues. Now, once Ford hired you then the union could step in and tell the company where to place you like the gravy jobs then after your 90 appoint you to the secretarial cushy jobs. I'm not pickin on you by any means I just started ranting and did not feel like opening another thread. One more thing promoting vandilism on this open fourm too me is silly. I'll tell you why, once this persons Toyota gets damaged in any way, wether it be at Ford or Wal Marts parking lot, she now has evidence pointing to co workers at Ford. I feel your fustration, I will as long as I work at Ford will buy Ford products. Ford pays my salary not the union, not Toyota, not Wal Mart, Ford. |
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Post by sickofit on Jan 28, 2011 2:21:57 GMT -5
One more thing, the question brought up about getting Toyota to go union. Here is my take, may be wrong, may be right.
There is a reason Toyota has not gone union. Is it because the company treats them good? I worked in a non union plant before I was hired on here. The company I worked for paid us production bonuses every month. I never recieved a bonus less than 250.00 the whole time I worked there. The company provided a Christmas bonus along with a formal dinner with our families. It was family owned not a corporation, the owner walked the floor everyday. We had no need for a union there. The company treated us fair. You come to work and do your job you stay employed. Long story short the owner sold the buisness and the new owner moved it to Mexico.
You see union or not companies will do whatever they want. I feel no more secure working in a union plant than I do working in a non union plant. Companies put profit over employment any day.
I do like the fact we are union. Allthough I feel sometimes it's abused by not only the elected and appointed people but, it's abused by the members on the floor. It's a people thing and nobody is perfect. I like the benifits that the past union has fought for. I'm aggravated about the benifits i've lost or should say "given away" I don't place the blame on anyone or the union, just the situation of the times.
Do I feel that if Toyota goes union we will be on an equal playing field? Nope. Buisness is buisness, union or not. How can that even be a question when GM filed bankruptcy to clean their books. They are union and we are not on an equal playing field.
The union needs to boost it's membership plain and simple. That is why they want every Tom dick and Harry to become unionized. Look at the amount of members it lost with the buyouts. We have not replaced them nor does Ford want to. Membership drops the amount of income drops. Just like Ford the union is a buisness plain and simple. They could careless about you and me, it's about the dollar. The UAW now has to flip the bill for our retirees healthcare and pension. Stupid move if you ask me. Now the company will work you till you are disabled and spit you out and the union picks up the tab.
We need to start fighting something I feel has been lacking a few years after I hired in to keep jobs in house. Use our time study people to actually do their jobs and time study every job at Ford. Their should not be one job here that has not been time studied. Failure on the unions part. Ergonomics needs to verify every job is ergonomically sound for the operator. If not failure on the unions part. We are all getting older and new people will be hired in with lower wages. One day those new people will run this union and sell each and everyone of us down the river.
Realignments all over the plant. Jobs gone will never come back. More membership money lost for the UAW. If the union has no say in eliminating jobs then why have a union? We are losing benifits, jobs, wages and morale. We all need to wake up and see what's happening. It's easy to get lax in your job, if burnout is a question step back take a breather and get back to work. I had a team leader that got burned out he quit, came back to the line, got the fire back and was one he'll of a team leader.
We all have too work together. Plain and simple. If not membership will decline and the money won't be there when we retire. When I hired in this was a very involved local. I would love to see us get that fire back. Not just elected but all members.
Well, I guess I just shit all over this thread and went totally off topic.
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Yet you still get to park close to the gate! Goddammit! 
