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Post by beenaround on Oct 30, 2017 7:11:50 GMT -5
And that is factual!!!!! Great post 1976
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Post by Ex-metalman on Oct 31, 2017 12:37:40 GMT -5
Lets suppose on any given day body shop averages 70 jph, for the sake of example:
Total for the week if tagging: 8,400 units ((70jph x 40 hours) x 3 crews)
Total for the week if massing: 7,692 units (((70jph x 36 hours) + (11jph x 4 hours)) x 3 crews)
This lowers production by 708 units per WEEK.
If mass break is made permanent AND a shift is eliminated, production will fall by 2,564 units per WEEK.
If they go back to relieving AND a shift is eliminated, production will fall by 2,800 units per WEEK.
Trimming production a little by mass relieving from time to time is not on its own an indication that a shift is about to be eliminated. Body has done it before, is doing it now, and will do it again. And has had 3 shifts for 19 years. At 70jph LINE SPEED, mass relieving effectively lowers average daily production to 64.1jph.
"Oh yeah? Well we're gonna go back to traditional shifts I bet!" Not so fast.
Going back to around the clock 8 hour shifts results in the same levels of production at 40 hours per week, IF 70 jph can be maintained, which it will not because maintenance will not be able to work on equipment in between shifts. The only time they would be able to, without losing production, would be on the weekend. The average jph would end up being much lower than even the mass relief average of 64.1.
The slight up front cost savings from going back to 3 traditional shifts would be reversed by this maintenance work that could have otherwise been done between shifts with a minimal loss in production, which would instead have to be worked on DURING production if they couldn't wait until the weekend. Body shop already went thru this the last time they went back to traditionals, which was only done because of the economic collapse anyway. Production suffered. And going to 2 shifts would cost the plant nearly 3 thousand units per week.
However, this is the auto industry, so you new people should be basing your budgets on 40 hours, no overtime, no shift premiums. Because you never know.
THat is true but...The last 2) weeks A-Crew has been running 650-700 jobs per day while C-crew has been running 480-540?And B crew not much better than C..Not sayin just sayin |
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Post by Ex-metalman on Oct 31, 2017 12:40:42 GMT -5
Go to our local union for accurate factual information? Really? I'll never forget that our local agreed to allow the company to schedule daily overtime beyond the contractual agreement and told the membership the extra-contractual concession was to prevent some of our Super Duty chassis cab production from being outsourced. At the same time those in the know were aware that part of our chassis cab production being sent to OHAP was a DONE DEAL. Just saying.... Word!!! |
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Post by machination on Oct 31, 2017 15:03:48 GMT -5
Go to our local union for accurate factual information? Really? I'll never forget that our local agreed to allow the company to schedule daily overtime beyond the contractual agreement and told the membership the extra-contractual concession was to prevent some of our Super Duty chassis cab production from being outsourced. At the same time those in the know were aware that part of our chassis cab production being sent to OHAP was a DONE DEAL. Just saying.... He does have a point TonyV. And I don't recall the union offering a satisfactory explanation for why this happened the way it did. Or does the union believe that people who don't attend the meetings don't deserve an explanation, which is the VAST MAJORITY of the dues paying members.
If that is the case, and I KNOW that it is among some union officials just from listening to various committeemen, think about this: How would the the union fare if only the hundred people who attended the meetings kept paying dues and everyone else stopped? Seems to me that the OCEAN of people on the floor who don't attend the meetings are more deserving of an explanation than the droplets who go to the meetings, since they would be the first ones to rip up their cards since right-to-be-a-leech passed, am I right? Think about that then let us know about that chassis-cab thing.
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Post by agslater on Oct 31, 2017 15:06:26 GMT -5
Lets suppose on any given day body shop averages 70 jph, for the sake of example:
Total for the week if tagging: 8,400 units ((70jph x 40 hours) x 3 crews)
Total for the week if massing: 7,692 units (((70jph x 36 hours) + (11jph x 4 hours)) x 3 crews)
This lowers production by 708 units per WEEK.
If mass break is made permanent AND a shift is eliminated, production will fall by 2,564 units per WEEK.
If they go back to relieving AND a shift is eliminated, production will fall by 2,800 units per WEEK.
Trimming production a little by mass relieving from time to time is not on its own an indication that a shift is about to be eliminated. Body has done it before, is doing it now, and will do it again. And has had 3 shifts for 19 years. At 70jph LINE SPEED, mass relieving effectively lowers average daily production to 64.1jph.
"Oh yeah? Well we're gonna go back to traditional shifts I bet!" Not so fast.
Going back to around the clock 8 hour shifts results in the same levels of production at 40 hours per week, IF 70 jph can be maintained, which it will not because maintenance will not be able to work on equipment in between shifts. The only time they would be able to, without losing production, would be on the weekend. The average jph would end up being much lower than even the mass relief average of 64.1.
The slight up front cost savings from going back to 3 traditional shifts would be reversed by this maintenance work that could have otherwise been done between shifts with a minimal loss in production, which would instead have to be worked on DURING production if they couldn't wait until the weekend. Body shop already went thru this the last time they went back to traditionals, which was only done because of the economic collapse anyway. Production suffered. And going to 2 shifts would cost the plant nearly 3 thousand units per week.
However, this is the auto industry, so you new people should be basing your budgets on 40 hours, no overtime, no shift premiums. Because you never know.
THat is true but...The last 2) weeks A-Crew has been running 650-700 jobs per day while C-crew has been running 480-540?And B crew not much better than C..Not sayin just sayin B crew frame has been doing around 730 per night last 2 weeks. Line 2 on average 20-30 more than A crew does on day. |
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Post by Ex-metalman on Oct 31, 2017 16:40:51 GMT -5
THat is true but...The last 2) weeks A-Crew has been running 650-700 jobs per day while C-crew has been running 480-540?And B crew not much better than C..Not sayin just sayin B crew frame has been doing around 730 per night last 2 weeks. Line 2 on average 20-30 more than A crew does on day. I was speaking of the area I work in which is Body.. |
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Post by thetruth1 on Nov 2, 2017 11:03:39 GMT -5
I didnt buy a new vehicle but those who did they bought Ford vehicles. I see people on here worried about those who did..get over yourself..most of these 18-20year olds are some second gen Ford babies living at your house anyway so they will be fine. At least they support the brand..Also the world was spinning before Ford and will after Ford.The model is to get rid of as many legacy employees that they feel are overpaid and grow in the progression employees through the downturn. As for quality,men lie,women lie but the numbers dont lie, Ccrew is killing it..Management hates legacy because they are hard to work with.Nothing last forever, take the buyout whenever they offer it..retire go away..oh I forgot working on second Ford marriage, 3 kids, you cant..quit trying to scare people..Fact is Ford would rather have progression than a tired old functional alcoholic legacy employee..it will all run without you believe me.
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Post by Ex-metalman on Nov 2, 2017 12:23:07 GMT -5
I didnt buy a new vehicle but those who did they bought Ford vehicles. I see people on here worried about those who did..get over yourself..most of these 18-20year olds are some second gen Ford babies living at your house anyway so they will be fine. At least they support the brand..Also the world was spinning before Ford and will after Ford.The model is to get rid of as many legacy employees that they feel are overpaid and grow in the progression employees through the downturn. As for quality,men lie,women lie but the numbers dont lie, Ccrew is killing it..Management hates legacy because they are hard to work with.Nothing last forever, take the buyout whenever they offer it..retire go away..oh I forgot working on second Ford marriage, 3 kids, you cant..quit trying to scare people..Fact is Ford would rather have progression than a tired old functional alcoholic legacy employee..it will all run without you believe me. You're definitely a POS!I work with legacy men and women everyday.We get along fine with management..It's you lazy bastards that can't get to work ON TIME or show up altogether..WE THE LEGACIES RUN THIS PLACE.When you're in the soup line we will still be getting overpaid and giving you a winter coat to wear...YOU FUCKING GO AWAY BOY! |
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Post by ktpveteran6499 on Nov 2, 2017 14:23:37 GMT -5
I didnt buy a new vehicle but those who did they bought Ford vehicles. I see people on here worried about those who did..get over yourself..most of these 18-20year olds are some second gen Ford babies living at your house anyway so they will be fine. At least they support the brand..Also the world was spinning before Ford and will after Ford.The model is to get rid of as many legacy employees that they feel are overpaid and grow in the progression employees through the downturn. As for quality,men lie,women lie but the numbers dont lie, Ccrew is killing it..Management hates legacy because they are hard to work with.Nothing last forever, take the buyout whenever they offer it..retire go away..oh I forgot working on second Ford marriage, 3 kids, you cant..quit trying to scare people..Fact is Ford would rather have progression than a tired old functional alcoholic legacy employee..it will all run without you believe me. You're definitely a POS!I work with legacy men and women everyday.We get along fine with management..It's you lazy bastards that can't get to work ON TIME or show up altogether..WE THE LEGACIES RUN THIS PLACE.When you're in the soup line we will still be getting overpaid and giving you a winter coat to wear...YOU FUCKING GO AWAY BOY! You both brought up excellent points, but honestly, that last little rant metalman was uncalled for. Not sayin, just sayin |
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Post by Ex-metalman on Nov 2, 2017 14:41:06 GMT -5
🖕🏿
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Post by machination on Nov 2, 2017 15:32:30 GMT -5
I didnt buy a new vehicle but those who did they bought Ford vehicles. I see people on here worried about those who did..get over yourself..most of these 18-20year olds are some second gen Ford babies living at your house anyway so they will be fine. At least they support the brand..Also the world was spinning before Ford and will after Ford.The model is to get rid of as many legacy employees that they feel are overpaid and grow in the progression employees through the downturn. As for quality,men lie,women lie but the numbers dont lie, Ccrew is killing it..Management hates legacy because they are hard to work with.Nothing last forever, take the buyout whenever they offer it..retire go away..oh I forgot working on second Ford marriage, 3 kids, you cant..quit trying to scare people..Fact is Ford would rather have progression than a tired old functional alcoholic legacy employee..it will all run without you believe me. LOL |
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Post by machination on Nov 2, 2017 15:46:46 GMT -5
Which departments are you referring to that have lower quality coming from C Crew? And why is this the case? The jobs are pretty straight forward. You either do them or you don't. Is the shop in final having to pick up a lot of what people have missed? Are the presses in stamping suddenly acting differently after a shift change? Are the metal finishers missing stuff and paint is hollering? Could you be more specific? Or is this just a "fuck C Crew" thread now?
And even if this was true the company isn't going to just give up, throw in the towel, and tearfully explain that "oh gosh shareholders we just can't fix anything right and are just going to cut plant production by a third because we're too scared of the big bad mean old sloppy ass C Crew workers and ran out of 4600s" or some shit. Gtfo with that stupid nonsense. If quality needs an injection then it's ball breaking time across the line, and the company has a lot more experience crushing nuts when necessary than the new hires have at letting every feeble rumor shake their hearts. |
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Post by TonyV on Nov 2, 2017 16:31:48 GMT -5
Go to our local union for accurate factual information? Really? I'll never forget that our local agreed to allow the company to schedule daily overtime beyond the contractual agreement and told the membership the extra-contractual concession was to prevent some of our Super Duty chassis cab production from being outsourced. At the same time those in the know were aware that part of our chassis cab production being sent to OHAP was a DONE DEAL. Just saying.... He does have a point TonyV. And I don't recall the union offering a satisfactory explanation for why this happened the way it did. Or does the union believe that people who don't attend the meetings don't deserve an explanation, which is the VAST MAJORITY of the dues paying members.
If that is the case, and I KNOW that it is among some union officials just from listening to various committeemen, think about this: How would the the union fare if only the hundred people who attended the meetings kept paying dues and everyone else stopped? Seems to me that the OCEAN of people on the floor who don't attend the meetings are more deserving of an explanation than the droplets who go to the meetings, since they would be the first ones to rip up their cards since right-to-be-a-leech passed, am I right? Think about that then let us know about that chassis-cab thing.
So you eliminate the source of information? It's just an order bank. Numbers reported. Always verify your sources of information also. Then feel free to call the union out at the meeting if they are in fact lying. That is the correct venue for just that. I'd rather see their face and watch their expressions personally. |
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Post by machination on Nov 2, 2017 18:12:22 GMT -5
He does have a point TonyV. And I don't recall the union offering a satisfactory explanation for why this happened the way it did. Or does the union believe that people who don't attend the meetings don't deserve an explanation, which is the VAST MAJORITY of the dues paying members.
If that is the case, and I KNOW that it is among some union officials just from listening to various committeemen, think about this: How would the the union fare if only the hundred people who attended the meetings kept paying dues and everyone else stopped? Seems to me that the OCEAN of people on the floor who don't attend the meetings are more deserving of an explanation than the droplets who go to the meetings, since they would be the first ones to rip up their cards since right-to-be-a-leech passed, am I right? Think about that then let us know about that chassis-cab thing.
So you eliminate the source of information? It's just an order bank. Numbers reported. Always verify your sources of information also. Then feel free to call the union out at the meeting if they are in fact lying. That is the correct venue for just that. I'd rather see their face and watch their expressions personally. Personally, I think it's important for the union officials to clear up any prevalent misperceptions that exist on the floor if they are in fact misperceptions. I could be mistaken but I believe your above post is implying that the chassis-cab issue was misunderstood on the floor.
The belief among many people is that the union agreed to waive the section of the agreement limiting our maximum involuntary working hours in a day of 10.7 in order to work us 11 instead, on condition that the chassis cab production would stay at our plant instead of moving to Ohio. Then after a year or so of this it moved to Ohio anyway.
If the union officials would have made clear to everyone that this arrangement was only to defer the inevitable movement of production to Ohio for another year, instead of preventing it's movement entirely, then there wouldn't be so many people believing that something fishy happened after chassis cab production left anyway. Clarity would have squashed this from the beginning, if it was in fact a misperception.
The implication that the dues payers who don't go to the union meetings, which is the vast majority of the membership, don't deserve a clear explanation on the floor when some clarity on a particular issue is apparently needed, really makes it look like the union has some disdain for this vast majority of members. A simple flier handed out by the committeemen would be sufficient to remedy this. When meeting attendance isn't as high as the leadership would like it's still important to make sure everyone else gets clear information on the floor.
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Post by TonyV on Nov 2, 2017 21:32:38 GMT -5
I did not imply a damned thing.
I said what I meant.
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Post by machination on Nov 3, 2017 8:29:11 GMT -5
I did not imply a damned thing. I said what I meant.
Copy that. You definitely said what you meant. Answering a question about the aforementioned chassis-cab issue with an ambiguous:
"It's just an order bank. Numbers reported."
Wow thanks for clearing that up with a non-answer. But at least you meant it that way.
So was I correct in stating that changing the max involuntary time was only to defer the inevitable moving of chassis cabs for another year? Because that would have been an unambiguous answer that would put it to rest.
So you said what you meant alright, which was to not answer the damned question. |
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Post by driveshaftgrunt on Nov 3, 2017 13:19:47 GMT -5
"Management hates legacy people because they are hard to work with."
I think that's true.
We do things like buck them when they try to violate us on contractual matters. Most of us understand that kissing their asses won't get us anywhere. Some of us even enjoy calling them out on their bullshit.
And they know they can get away with fucking the eyes out of some in progression emmployees because they don't always know better.
So, yeah, Management does hate legacy people. BTW, C-crew quality is shit....
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Post by machination on Nov 3, 2017 16:53:03 GMT -5
BTW, C-crew quality is shit.... That's fine but where though? LOL I really am curious. Shit metal from stamping? Less stock parts going to shop? |
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Post by Ex-metalman on Nov 4, 2017 9:16:34 GMT -5
"Management hates legacy people because they are hard to work with." I think that's true. We do things like buck them when they try to violate us on contractual matters. Most of us understand that kissing their asses won't get us anywhere. Some of us even enjoy calling them out on their bullshit. And they know they can get away with fucking the eyes out of some in progression emmployees because they don't always know better. So, yeah, Management does hate legacy people. BTW, C-crew quality is shit.... In body it's totally opposite..The new people are late and cry about everything,and the old ones do what they're told like robots.(not me)So I don't see management hating us.The union Prolly does though? |
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Post by driveshaftgrunt on Nov 4, 2017 10:25:24 GMT -5
BTW, C-crew quality is shit.... That's fine but where though? LOL I really am curious. Shit metal from stamping? Less stock parts going to shop? I can't comment on paint and metal, because I don't know how long it takes those issues from c-crew to get to a. But I will say this, the stuff you see in trim and on the cal line from C-crew on Monday and Tuesday morning is AMAZING. |
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Post by thetruth1 on Nov 5, 2017 6:46:23 GMT -5
First off, who knew i would get so much reaction. Ccrew is new and we get the legacy point of view..there will be no bread lines for anyone either bc no ones going anywhere. Xmas bonus, and profit sharing right around the corner, both will be the same amount as legacy except i put the entire amount into 401k so there a lil better tax issue because my family dorsnt need the money at this time. As for legacy bucking mgmt plaeeeeze! Ive never seen so much name dropping and ass kissing from union men and women..These Ccrew crack babies,meth heads, heroin addicts could give a rats ass about mgmt or legacy..those of us caught in between you all get all the bs..On time, never miss days, know 30 jobs on the line and care about the quality of work..Time in doesnt make you better, the reason its all the way it is including, wages,ccrew,mgmt, quality and the state of the union is bc of legacy..you all have rolled over so much in the last two decades..Ford runs the plant now with 3 teirs and duhh vision..when they offer the buyout take it dont hesitate, you will still be able to tell people that you worked at Ford..lol
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Post by thetruth1 on Nov 5, 2017 7:38:53 GMT -5
And just so we are clear, there ate quality issues at this moment that are all over the place..welds, seats, running boards, brakes, and we should all be working together A,B,and Ccrew to help put out the best product ever..instead you ex-metalman are attacking people on here..the BOY comment i will ignore bc you are ignorant.
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Post by Ex-metalman on Nov 5, 2017 7:53:46 GMT -5
Get spell check for starters..One question ?If you're so smart why do you work here?For half the pay?Oh I know you have NO skills..You sound like a little tattle taler..Bet you gossip a lot with the women on your team about how you would be a better TL than the current one..I have 6 more years and I know my FUTURE,because we (1993,1995 ) made KTP what It is..You haven't done shit..So lay in there and get it..PS thanks for "overlooking"the boy comment...Lmao!🖕🏿🖕🏿🖕🏿🖕🏿🖕🏿🖕🏿🖕🏿🖕🏿🖕🏿🖕🏿🖕🏿🖕🏿🖕🏿🖕🏿🖕🏿🖕🏿🖕🏿🖕🏿PS to the second power...I have over 500k in tesphe so SUCK IT!
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Post by nra4life on Nov 5, 2017 9:32:05 GMT -5
First off, who knew i would get so much reaction. Ccrew is new and we get the legacy point of view..there will be no bread lines for anyone either bc no ones going anywhere. Xmas bonus, and profit sharing right around the corner, both will be the same amount as legacy except i put the entire amount into 401k so there a lil better tax issue because my family dorsnt need the money at this time. As for legacy bucking mgmt plaeeeeze! Ive never seen so much name dropping and ass kissing from union men and women..These Ccrew crack babies,meth heads, heroin addicts could give a rats ass about mgmt or legacy..those of us caught in between you all get all the bs..On time, never miss days, know 30 jobs on the line and care about the quality of work..Time in doesnt make you better, the reason its all the way it is including, wages,ccrew,mgmt, quality and the state of the union is bc of legacy..you all have rolled over so much in the last two decades..Ford runs the plant now with 3 teirs and duhh vision..when they offer the buyout take it dont hesitate, you will still be able to tell people that you worked at Ford..lol Lol, you do realize at the end of the day someone has to build a truck or we don’t have a job right? On time, yes, never miss a day, yes, know 30 jobs, no, but the 3 I do know I do right and don’t miss a beat. Why? Because if you don’t come to work, and if your late, and if your so hard to get along with Management they will come to a breaking point and shut the whole thing down and move on. Don’t believe me? Ask around, we have guys from numerous plants that brag about “our local didn’t put up with this bullshit, etc”. Well that’s great but Ford said fuck it, closed it down. They had to pack up theirfamily and move 500 miles away from family and friends. Ask around about paint departments at other plants that never had a truck go through them because Ford got fed up and shut it down. Don’t think they won’t do it here someday. We are all just a number, they have no loyalty to any of us. Control what you can, come to work...on time...build the truck they way they want you to, go home. The rest is out of our control. Stay safe people. |
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Post by machination on Nov 6, 2017 5:04:47 GMT -5
First off, who knew i would get so much reaction. Ccrew is new and we get the legacy point of view..there will be no bread lines for anyone either bc no ones going anywhere. Xmas bonus, and profit sharing right around the corner, both will be the same amount as legacy except i put the entire amount into 401k so there a lil better tax issue because my family dorsnt need the money at this time. As for legacy bucking mgmt plaeeeeze! Ive never seen so much name dropping and ass kissing from union men and women..These Ccrew crack babies,meth heads, heroin addicts could give a rats ass about mgmt or legacy..those of us caught in between you all get all the bs..On time, never miss days, know 30 jobs on the line and care about the quality of work..Time in doesnt make you better, the reason its all the way it is including, wages,ccrew,mgmt, quality and the state of the union is bc of legacy..you all have rolled over so much in the last two decades..Ford runs the plant now with 3 teirs and duhh vision..when they offer the buyout take it dont hesitate, you will still be able to tell people that you worked at Ford..lol Over-generalizations, exaggerations, selective judgements, excessive belief in your own bullshit, all typical symptoms of an overconfident cocky new kid who obviously has no idea what the fuck he's talking about, LOL And C crew isn't new. Body and paint have had C crew for 20 years. And we don't have 3 tiers you dumb shit. We have the same division of wage progression towards top pay plus temps that we've had for over 25 years not counting the brief period of 2-tier which was corrected in the last agreement, just with a different time scale for the progression and instead of firing and rehiring "89-day people" now we call them sts or lts and don't fire them after 89 days. That's actually an improvement for them from the old way. So stfu and go have some cookies and milk you dumb shit, LOL |
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Post by thisplacesux on Nov 6, 2017 5:10:12 GMT -5
First off, who knew i would get so much reaction. Ccrew is new and we get the legacy point of view..there will be no bread lines for anyone either bc no ones going anywhere. Xmas bonus, and profit sharing right around the corner, both will be the same amount as legacy except i put the entire amount into 401k so there a lil better tax issue because my family dorsnt need the money at this time. As for legacy bucking mgmt plaeeeeze! Ive never seen so much name dropping and ass kissing from union men and women..These Ccrew crack babies,meth heads, heroin addicts could give a rats ass about mgmt or legacy..those of us caught in between you all get all the bs..On time, never miss days, know 30 jobs on the line and care about the quality of work..Time in doesnt make you better, the reason its all the way it is including, wages,ccrew,mgmt, quality and the state of the union is bc of legacy..you all have rolled over so much in the last two decades..Ford runs the plant now with 3 teirs and duhh vision..when they offer the buyout take it dont hesitate, you will still be able to tell people that you worked at Ford..lol Over-generalizations, exaggerations, selective judgements, excessive belief in your own bullshit, all typical symptoms of an overconfident cocky new kid who obviously has no idea what the fuck he's talking about, LOL And we don't have 3 tiers you dumb shit. We have the same division of wage progression towards top pay plus temps that we've had for over 25 years, just with a different time scale for the progression and instead of firing and rehiring "89-day people" now we call them sts or lts and don't fire them after 89 days. That's actually an improvement for them from the old way. So stfu and go have some cookies and milk you dumb shit, LOL C-crew is new? Who knew? 🤷🏻♂️ |
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Post by remember1976 on Nov 6, 2017 11:03:41 GMT -5
I am a legacy hourly employee and I will tell you this:
A salaried employee visiting from MAP told me he thought it was remarkable how compliant the local union is at KTP. He said it ain’t like that up in Michigan. I told him that every transfer to this plant says the same thing but that no one from here believes them. And I know the local leadership itself denies being softer than other UAW locals.
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Post by machination on Nov 6, 2017 13:28:05 GMT -5
I am a legacy hourly employee and I will tell you this: A salaried employee visiting from MAP told me he thought it was remarkable how compliant the local union is at KTP. He said it ain’t like that up in Michigan. I told him that every transfer to this plant says the same thing but that no one from here believes them. And I know the local leadership itself denies being softer than other UAW locals. Yet we have transfers from all over the country because their "tough" locals couldn't manage to keep those peoples jobs for them. So they get to come to KTP instead of starving in the cheese line. Funny how that's working out ain't it? If the transfers think their locals were better for them then they should go back to where they came from....oh wait that's right they don't have a job there anymore. Guess their local wasn't so good after all huh |
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Post by beenaround on Nov 6, 2017 15:00:01 GMT -5
Machination, I think you need to get your facts straight. Ford shutting down assembly plants was directly related to ford trying to consolidate plants with flexible lines that could produce multiple vehicles on a single platform. Location of plants from vendors was a huge factor in determining which plants stayed and which were shut down. Local unions had very little to do with the closures. Unless you have worked at and have first hand knowledge of one of those plants then I believe you may want to keep those supposed allegations to yourself.
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Post by remember1976 on Nov 6, 2017 17:00:56 GMT -5
Correct beenaround.
Machination, ya’ll have got the local union you deserve.
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