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Post by rclap on Aug 7, 2010 14:30:43 GMT -5
They either need to calibrate that wet bulb so it works right rather than in the company's favor or shove it where the sun doesn't shine. It would probably read 83.9 there also. |
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Post by kessinger on Aug 7, 2010 16:06:50 GMT -5
Again, the wet/dry bulb test is not the temperature.
The only area that ever got heat break on a regular basis was cab hang in paint (prior to them putting in a booth with air) We knew it was going to get heat breaks when our little crappy thermometer from the state fair hit about 104. Now that isn't a solid temp due to humidity but that is what it took to get them at that spot.
We have been working on the fans on forklifts issue, I will try to update as we get closer to getting something resolved on it.
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Post by PUNISHER on Aug 7, 2010 17:47:34 GMT -5
well kessinger.....i came from lap...when we got heat breaks, i worked on chassis, not in paint....everyone got heat breaks there, so i don't know who you spoke with at lap but they mis-informed you......and i was loaned out to paint about 2 months ago and worked in the hang booth..guess what, only half the air was working...at one point I thought I was going to pass out and the guy I was working with told me to go take 10 min. to cool off and I was in shorts and t-shirt....at least we on the line are looking out for one another..too bad the union doesn't seem to be....and in case any of you missed the forecast for next week...M-98, T-100, W-101 and T-97.....fortunately for me I am scheduled off for wednesday and I will be taking an awol for tuesday...
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Post by JoePieper on Aug 7, 2010 20:14:25 GMT -5
I have a brilliant idea. If its 95 degrees I get a heat break. Oh im sorry that makes too much sense. Better yet how about AC in the plasma booth. Hell paint gets it in hang and unhang.
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Post by inspect96 on Aug 7, 2010 20:55:36 GMT -5
Kess, How bout getting fans on the Tugs and Griptows as well. Thanks Also, all the Tugs,Griptows and Forks borrowed from LAP HAVE fans. How do we not, just doesn't make sence to me.
It can't be that hard to figure a way for heat breaks.
90 degrees for water and Gatorade
over 95 outside automatic heat break.
Thats pretty easy..
if its 95 outside we know its over 100 inside so there ya go
If we dont do the heat breaks then there needs to be enough break rooms With Air for EVERYONE and more fans and water fountains.
Some of our fans dont even work or theres 200years of dirt on them..get them cleaned.
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Post by kessinger on Aug 7, 2010 22:59:51 GMT -5
Days or nights punisher? As stated they did say that about days. We also have had heat breaks in the past, on nights. You were about to pass out and didn't goto medical? Why? People going to medical for those situations helps us fight it. It gives us proof that it is causing health issues. You sure on your time frame punisher 2 months ago? The hottest day we had in June was 80 degrees? I know hang is hotter but that hot suprises me.
We started working on the fans on equipment. We haven't had them in years here and til last week no one that I know of had requested them. We are trying to get this fixed but it won't be overnight.
If we were the only ones that had any say so on when you got heat breaks we would get them at 90. But that isn't the case, I wish it was.
Punisher you said "when we got heat breaks". So how often was that? We have 100 degree temps every year. Were you getting heat break everyday during the summer or was it a rare thing? For the record the other heat break thread has a guy posting hes been at LAP twenty years and never had a heat break, so I am getting mixed stories about heat breaks at LAP. I know you hate KTP and its union but lets get the facts. You make statements that lead people to believe you got heat breaks anytime someone asked for one, and I don't think that is the case, please clarify? How frequent did you get them, a week straight? 5 or 6 times a year?
PM me where you have the dirty fans (they cleaned a ton of em at shutdown) or not working ones and we will get them addressed.
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Post by buckeyeinky on Aug 8, 2010 7:37:19 GMT -5
I understand everyones bitch ,but why cant anyone do anything for themselfs. When you need a heat break tell the boss you dont feel well and go take a break, simple as that . Why do you need the union to step in ? take control WE are the union , dont bitch....do.If you need a break because you dont feel well and you take one and the union doesnt back you ...then we bitch, but until then be your own man or woman and get off the union's nipple and fight for what is right for yourself
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Post by readyandaimedatyou on Aug 8, 2010 13:00:15 GMT -5
100 degrees Tuesday... 101 degrees Wednesday this coming week...
Good Luck running FoMoCo.... I wont put myself at risk for money... i hope no one else does either. Going to medical is our ONLY choice besides an AWOL. The union is US... i wont blame commiteemen for no heat breaks... just go to medical if your sick from this crazy heat guys.
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Post by marcus on Aug 8, 2010 19:12:41 GMT -5
We got heat breaks at LAP in trim area on nights,but it wasnt a everyday thing.It was rare to get them but we got some,not sure on the numbers kess.
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Post by rocketman on Aug 8, 2010 20:14:48 GMT -5
Maybe somebody should contact WHAS-11 about what is going on...
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Post by brizzel on Aug 8, 2010 20:59:17 GMT -5
Maybe somebody should contact WHAS-11 about what is going on... Just what we need is the tagline, "As unemployment increases Ford workers complaining it's hot. More at 11" I know it is hot and miserable but drink plenty of fluids and deal with it. The company cares about numbers and its not the temperature. |
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Post by ktpschd on Aug 9, 2010 3:53:08 GMT -5
For those of you who actually thought the company would supply "thigh high kevlar leggings" (if they even exist) for the body shop...ummm...try to get a mental picture of your co-workers in shorts with bright yellow legs. It would look like a Foghorn Leghorn family reunion! Like the man said,"Everybody talks about the weather but no one does anything about it." My point was...if we wait for the company or the union to address the unbearable heat situation, the cure may be worse than the disease. The company cannot discipline anyone for going to medical due to possible heat prostration. Its symptoms are nausea, unusually profuse sweating, a sense of anxiety, and weakness or dizziness--i.e., a feeling of "faintness," caused by a drop in blood pressure and a slowing of the pulse. GET TO MEDICAL!
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Post by kessinger on Aug 9, 2010 12:22:52 GMT -5
Yes, as ktpschd says. This place isn't worth your life. We have had 16 medical visits due to heat related issues, zero writeups. Thankfully no serious issues. The worst cases have been where someone had a medical issue that the heat made much worse. So keep that in mind if you have high blood pressure or diabetes, the heat can make these issues worse. Please be careful.
Marcus, that was kinda my point, its a rare thing at any plant to get heat relief. Are there any folks on here that came form Atlanta? I wonder if they ever got em, it's way hotter there than here.
If you wanna hate us at KTP just hate us, don't use heat breaks as an issue since it works the same at both plants, or all plants for that matter since it is a UAW/Ford corporate policy.
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Post by meanjean on Aug 9, 2010 12:42:47 GMT -5
If you wanna hate us at KTP just hate us, don't use heat breaks as an issue since it works the same at both plants, or all plants for that matter since it is a UAW/Ford corporate policy. He pretty much hit the nail on the head right there. We are all Ford employees and it is our cross to bear.(lol) There are, I am sure, quite a few KTP'ers who hate it as well, including myself sometimes. It has to cool down sooner or later, so everyone just take care of yourself and go to medical if you need to. |
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Post by sjohn191 on Aug 9, 2010 12:48:14 GMT -5
But kessinger, there should be a diff standard for heat breaks, I know the test has to read 85 in any department. In trim and chas u can wear short t-top your body can breath now in body shop u wear long sleeves and pants, ur cover head to toe. It should be brought to the company to change the heat standard in each department due to what is required to be worn in that department. The test might say 83.9 but with all that clothing on it a lot hotter than that. When they first set these rules that when u could wear shorts in body shop, that didn't start changing that until 1999 or early 2000 due to so many people getting cut. Sum it all up the same heat standard should not be the same plant wide due to the clothing u have to wear that is required for that department.
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Post by marcus on Aug 9, 2010 16:40:00 GMT -5
brizzel good point in your last post.
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Post by tightline on Aug 9, 2010 18:20:20 GMT -5
people in stock need fans, the lifts and tugs batteries get so hot it feels like your wearing swimming trunks, can't even get a fan at my charging station, break room to far away and i was told to sit at another team's picnic table, and i said "would'nt I be taking someone's seat", and the committee man said we all have to get along, besides the operation in the area were i work has 12 fans and a chair for one operator, just want a fan while on break to cool down and not have to smell battery fumes
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Post by PUNISHER on Aug 9, 2010 18:30:31 GMT -5
kessinger...i worked dayshift on chassis line and I'm pretty sure we got the heat breaks for about a week.....I don't know who said he's been at LAP for 20 yrs and never got a heat break...maybe office worker..lol....I don't think it was every day of that week, maybe 4 of 5 but...I know it's been hot as hell and I've dealt with it...until last wednesday when I was loaned to body shop. I agree with sjohn191, there should be different standard for different departments regarding any heat break. It doesn't seem too fair to have someone wear a tank and shorts in other areas of the plant when in body you have to wear coveralls and sleeves and crap. I work in tire room on days (rarely lately, always loaned out) and I can tell you it is several degrees hotter in tire room than most parts of the plant....and believe me, I WILL not hesitate to go to medical if loaned to body, paint or stamping when it's mid 90's outside and easily 100 or more inside.....I hope everyone takes care of themselves.
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Post by lap65 on Aug 9, 2010 23:09:15 GMT -5
Never worked in an office, worked in trim, chassis & body shop. Maybe some people got them, I never have & have never heard of them til now, I wasnt trying to start an argument, I'm all for them & I will go to medical as well if necessary. Its no secret Ford Motor co. could care less about our health & welfare, everyone has to do what they have to do.
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Post by ScottR@KTP on Aug 9, 2010 23:52:37 GMT -5
One big problem at KTP, no unity. Most are too busy fucking their brothers/sisters to all team up and make trips to medical. I can remember about 75% of the sealer deck going to medical one night...then guess what happened? Heat breaks...it really isn't that hard of a game to play...I just don't see any willing players out here. Just a bunch of back-stabbing cowards.  The impression I get with this workforce is they quit fighting and caring years ago. |
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Post by mysteryjim on Aug 10, 2010 2:34:26 GMT -5
You got that right scott.....most people in my area are concerned with fucking their brothers/sisters and cozying up to management. Nobody in my area would DARE doing any of the things you requested. They'd rather tease and tell management you're a P.O.S. than stick up for you.
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Post by kessinger on Aug 10, 2010 7:49:52 GMT -5
I agree with everyone that the bodyshop should get an adjusment to the regualr reading. The problem is that they go off the ACGIH standard (Amercian Committee of Goverment Indutrial Hygenists) recommendations. They claim that temperture is for someone in work clothes, long sleeve shirt and pants, and you don't get and adjustment for coveralls unless they are double layer or limited vapor barrier. We are arguing that our coveralls aren't "regular" coveralls since they are treated to be fire resistant.
As far as sticking together, I think their are very few people that won't band together. But, it only takes one to screw the whole group. I am sure some of you have read my posts about people siding with their supervisor against their committeeperson in labor. The vast majoirty of people here would band together if you could weed out the one tht would rat them out for it.
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Post by PUNISHER on Aug 10, 2010 11:04:29 GMT -5
here is the response i got from LAP chairman when I asked him about us getting heat breaks at LAP...and it has happened "over the years"...not just a one time thing..and i totally agree with what you posted scott....
Chris,
There have been extra breaks over the years because of the heat, mainly in Body Shop and Sealer deck, but also in the main building.
Here is the Heat Stress booklet. Page 16 describes the program for fluids and breaks. Most of the readings are (WBGT) Wet Bulb and Globe Temperature described on Page 10.
LAP local agreement says water if the temperature is 90 degrees and Gatorade if the outside temperature is 95 degrees.
Steven M Stone
UAW Building Chairperson
Local 862/LAP
502-364-3657 (Office)
502-969-9136 (Hall)
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Post by Jr on Aug 10, 2010 15:28:01 GMT -5
When was the Last time The wet bulb machine was calibrated??
I'm gonna ask that about Lap's when we get back to work.
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Post by Jr on Aug 10, 2010 15:33:27 GMT -5
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Post by Ironman2301 on Aug 10, 2010 17:02:00 GMT -5
When they first set these rules that when u could wear shorts in body shop, that didn't start changing that until 1999 or early 2000 due to so many people getting cut. I have worked in the body shop science I hired in in early 1995, and we have never, NEVER be able to wear shorts in KTP's Body Shop. You could however wear a shirt with 3/4 sleeves and this was fine(no Kevlar was available at this time). You should be able to wear coveralls with NO KEVLAR sleeves. If you want to wear a t-shirt then wear the Kevlar. But I can never remember being able to wear shorts. Not taking sides or saying what is right or wrong, I'm just saying. |
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Post by watchmen on Aug 10, 2010 17:52:09 GMT -5
One big problem at KTP, no unity. Most are too busy fucking their brothers/sisters to all team up and make trips to medical. I can remember about 75% of the sealer deck going to medical one night...then guess what happened? Heat breaks...it really isn't that hard of a game to play...I just don't see any willing players out here. Just a bunch of back-stabbing cowards. The impression I get with this workforce is they quit fighting and caring years ago. Ok here we go again.... I have stated on this forum numerous times and i guess it still isnt getting thru so i will say it again. If LAP is so wonderful, full of so much joy and extra heat breaks then you should of kept your ass at LAP. Here is the kicker. I am from LAP also. I never remember LAP being this great almighty plant to work in. It was a shit hole the same as this one. |
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Post by ScottR@KTP on Aug 10, 2010 18:05:39 GMT -5
I think both places suck, but if you wanna say the union and management are the same, you need to open your eyes.
If I was in the top 10% at LAP with my seniority, I would have never left. Being that I am very close to the top 10% at KTP...I'm staying put, regardless of how shitty the place is IMHO. Many of us expect things to change...and many of us won't stop fighting until things are changed...unlike what I have witnessed at KTP the last 18 months.
I have already been in more departments and on more shifts than many KTPers which have called the place home for 10+ yrs. Frame nights, chassis nights, chassis days, body 3-11, body 11-7...and more to come.
My opinion on heat breaks...fuck a heat break. I don't need one...I'm a reliefman...it will only mess my night up if we do actually get heat breaks. But my gripe will always be, stand up people. If you feel you need or deserve a heat break, go to medical. But I see way too many chicken shit people. The last thing they want to do is upset their team leader or boss. Stop worrying about your image and take care of yourself.
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Post by pickle on Aug 10, 2010 18:45:23 GMT -5
Scott I releived body shop for 12 years saw heat breaks twice both times who ever was on break at ten til the hour I believe just lost it. It didnt mess me up at all ,but of course some bitched about getting screwed ( we got tag break and 10 mins. on the hour and I have to beleive it is as hot this week as then.Oh yeah I was B crew then peace brothers.
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Post by lucero on Aug 10, 2010 20:15:18 GMT -5
Hey Scott, You shoulda come to CAP. WE got a heat break when it got to 90 and gatorade and cool wraps, plus fresh squeezed lemonade ( alright, that last part about the lemonade I made up) But with your time you would probably be appointed chairman. Just something to think about.
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