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Post by hanswolo77 on Jul 20, 2015 13:22:19 GMT -5
Gonna need raises, and a huge bonus for starters. Also would like 25 and out. Go
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Post by tryingtomakeit on Jul 20, 2015 14:08:21 GMT -5
Everything we lost back. And raises. End of 2 tier.
Now i know that wont happen, but its what it will take to get a yes out of me.
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Post by Ex-metalman on Jul 20, 2015 14:44:38 GMT -5
Simple (but never noted yes so)?Raise of a substantial amount,early retirement at 20yrs(not expecting full ret.amount)no mandatory working hrs after 10 hrs.,One minute break back,day after Easter Sunday back.COLA back.2 tiers going nowhere,so that's off the table,And if none of that a large buyout so they can hire more low end employees....that's it.I would love to be gone come 2016..So I'm praying..
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Post by machination on Jul 21, 2015 5:24:01 GMT -5
Simple (but never noted yes so)?Raise of a substantial amount,early retirement at 20yrs(not expecting full ret.amount)no mandatory working hrs after 10 hrs.,One minute break back,day after Easter Sunday back.COLA back.2 tiers going nowhere,so that's off the table,And if none of that a large buyout so they can hire more low end employees....that's it.I would love to be gone come 2016..So I'm praying.. Early retirement at 20yrs isn't going to happen in any form other than a pension severing buyout. So your badge of "NO" honor isn't in any danger of being replaced with a "YES" badge of shame anytime soon ex-metalman. Congrats! |
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Post by Ex-metalman on Jul 21, 2015 9:54:28 GMT -5
So BACK to the thread topic???What would it take for you (machine) to vote yes?Or do you just wanna comment on all my replies?  ? |
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Post by ScottR@KTP on Jul 21, 2015 10:52:39 GMT -5
Here's how little it would take for the contract to pass...and there's many negatives that always go with the positives for some.
I will throw out the obvious gain the company will want for us to get ANY gains...25% 2nd tier at FoMoCo...current 2nd tier will get raises over the next contract (and I would go to a 5 year contract)...if we are talking percentages, give the 2nd tier 2%/1%/2%/1%/2% over the 5 years...do the same for legacy workers, but instead of 2/1/2/1/2, they only get 1/2/1/2/1 for 7% over 5 years...there has to be an hourly rate gain over the 5 years for all workers for this turd to pass.
There doesn't need to be any big signing bonus, $1500 would do as long as there is a raise every year.
Profit sharing formula will be altered to make up the difference for the hourly raises for all...Ford will not increase their cost to give us raises...so where they bring costs back down will be group insurance for all UAW workers (shopping around with that many employees will yield the companies a cheaper plan or we are all put on Obamacare if it's still around).
So reduced profit sharing and raising 2nd tier to 25% for all the current employees to receive raises, which will result in a higher pension payout in the end. Remember your pension is based on your hourly rate...your hourly rate has stayed the same for nearly 12 years, we must see our hourly rate go up...and we should be willing to do that for a reduced profit sharing, a smaller signing bonus, and to further sell out the ppl that don't even work here yet.
And current retirees need a raise in a bad way...if they gain nothing, it is an easy NO vote.
There's just a few of the obvious things.
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Post by pmooret on Jul 21, 2015 11:16:48 GMT -5
Hi Scott, you've been quite lately. Question: had we gotten our usual and customary raises over the last twelve years what would that add up to?
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Post by hanswolo77 on Jul 21, 2015 13:54:05 GMT -5
Here's how little it would take for the contract to pass...and there's many negatives that always go with the positives for some. I will throw out the obvious gain the company will want for us to get ANY gains...25% 2nd tier at FoMoCo...current 2nd tier will get raises over the next contract (and I would go to a 5 year contract)...if we are talking percentages, give the 2nd tier 2%/1%/2%/1%/2% over the 5 years...do the same for legacy workers, but instead of 2/1/2/1/2, they only get 1/2/1/2/1 for 7% over 5 years...there has to be an hourly rate gain over the 5 years for all workers for this turd to pass. There doesn't need to be any big signing bonus, $1500 would do as long as there is a raise every year. Profit sharing formula will be altered to make up the difference for the hourly raises for all...Ford will not increase their cost to give us raises...so where they bring costs back down will be group insurance for all UAW workers (shopping around with that many employees will yield the companies a cheaper plan or we are all put on Obamacare if it's still around). So reduced profit sharing and raising 2nd tier to 25% for all the current employees to receive raises, which will result in a higher pension payout in the end. Remember your pension is based on your hourly rate...your hourly rate has stayed the same for nearly 12 years, we must see our hourly rate go up...and we should be willing to do that for a reduced profit sharing, a smaller signing bonus, and to further sell out the ppl that don't even work here yet. And current retirees need a raise in a bad way...if they gain nothing, it is an easy NO vote. There's just a few of the obvious things. |
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Post by hanswolo77 on Jul 21, 2015 13:56:26 GMT -5
In other words set the bar low, hope to get less in bonuses and pretend it's 2003. And it'll pass 51-49 as usual
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Post by nra4life on Jul 21, 2015 14:03:57 GMT -5
For me its reinstatement of cola & a minimum 2% raise, also a reduction of my union dues back to 2 hr wages per month. No contract longer than the current 4 yr deal. The free day of labor they get every year from all North American plants the Monday after Easter would easily pay for for a small raise & reinstatement of COLA.
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Post by ScottR@KTP on Jul 22, 2015 5:50:49 GMT -5
Hi Scott, you've been quite lately. Question: had we gotten our usual and customary raises over the last twelve years what would that add up to? If we calculate 2% raise for 10 years, $35.63 would be ARPed out...so easily $34.50-$35.60/hour...$15,100 more on just 40 hours straight time, no shift premium, annually. |
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Post by ScottR@KTP on Jul 22, 2015 5:54:00 GMT -5
In other words set the bar low, hope to get less in bonuses and pretend it's 2003. And it'll pass 51-49 as usual If we can get an hourly raise ANNUALLY, that's about all we can hope for...but since our union is sharing a pillow with the company in the form of VEBA, which the account balance is dictated by the share price of the Big 3, they can't take the risk of raising the costs for the companies. That's why you hear the union say over and over, "we can't raise their costs"...they should be saying, "we can't hurt the stock prices, we neeed them go up so VEBA doesn't bankrupt". Pre-VEBA, the union was about getting us more, now it's nothing like that. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2015 11:01:32 GMT -5
Veba or no veba ( although I'm not arguing with ur point) union or no union ,everything revolves around stock performance everywhere now. It's a free gift from the global economy lie we have been led into. That's why making " record profits" isn't even good enough anymore. If ford returns a nickel profit per dollar invested and Toyota returns 7 cents, our stock will fall, and it will always be taken out on us, because like you say, the union isn't looking out for us. I don't think they know how to anymore
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Post by pmooret on Jul 22, 2015 14:37:07 GMT -5
Hi Scott, you've been quite lately. Question: had we gotten our usual and customary raises over the last twelve years what would that add up to? If we calculate 2% raise for 10 years, $35.63 would be ARPed out...so easily $34.50-$35.60/hour...$15,100 more on just 40 hours straight time, no shift premium, annually. So it looks like they owe us about six dollars an hour right out of the gate just to catch us up to where we should be. Don't let them screw us again without a fight. COLA is a must. Hey they danced, it's time to pay the fiddler! |
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Post by imdadd on Jul 22, 2015 19:25:10 GMT -5
Do you believe in miracles!
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Post by ktpbob on Jul 22, 2015 20:00:05 GMT -5
I would like raises and cola back like the rest of you. But here's what I'm thinking we might be offered. I think the 2nd tier employees will get raises equaling $1 per yr of the contract and legacy employees, like myself, will get raises equaling .50 per yr to put us over the $30 per hr mark by 4th yr. That will bring 2nd tier closer to us but will take a few more contracts for them to catch up. Also I think the company wants more than the current 20% of 2nd tier workers and even more than the 25% Scott says they'll push for. I think they'll push for 30 to 40% and in return offer 25 and out retirement to legacy workers over 50 yrs old. At a reduced rate of course! JMO
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Post by fedupfred on Jul 22, 2015 21:20:49 GMT -5
I think ktpbob is pretty close to right. For myself I actually like to work to live like we once did , not live to work like we do now. So unless there is language about no more 11 hours shifts, which of course there won't be, I will be a NO !! But it will pass 51 to 49. It's like the old line communists used to say " it doesn't matter who casts the votes, only who COUNTS the votes ".
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Post by pmooret on Jul 23, 2015 4:04:57 GMT -5
Do you believe in miracles! No I don't believe in miracles but everybody seems to forget how much we have actually lost over the years. A one, two or even higher percent raise every year is in line but when the contract is passed, there should be a SIGNIFICANT raise from day one. |
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Post by ScottR@KTP on Jul 23, 2015 7:16:16 GMT -5
I would love to see a 3% raise day one, with a raise every year after, but we will take many other losses for that to happen. Our union is no longer in the business to raise the costs of the companies.
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Post by rushrush1 on Jul 23, 2015 8:07:05 GMT -5
The union is supposably negotiating for us, which we all know the union is negotiating to keep themselves in business. The only person representing the worker is you and I . So the way I see it , we are negotiating for ourselves with our vote. I don't know about you, but when I negotiate I never accept the first offer. No vote from me no matter what.
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Post by Ex-metalman on Jul 23, 2015 9:40:59 GMT -5
If I'm the Co I'm trying to get rid of as many legacy workers as I can each year before(2023-2025) ..And raising the number(%) of lower tier workers..But that will cost the union on dues..Unless they made a MIDDLE tier and raised the current low tier to middle level status.?My opinion is that what we make now (and even if we get a raise) will be gone when we all retire.And the new HIGH pay will be whatever the current low tier are making when those years come up...They'll never make 28.76..I'll take buyout and be happy but not 50,000...I'll take 20 and out At a pro rated amount or 25 at a pro rated sum..I really just wanna be done with this place ...But won't take some kind of bullshit contract til that happens..
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Post by lucifer on Jul 26, 2015 5:00:34 GMT -5
I want a raise, first and foremost. $2-3 an hour over the life of the contract would be iffy, $3-5 would be better. New hires would get a $6-9 raise. Get COLA back, maybe even use COLA to even out the 2 tier pay difference. I want money on the hour, period. Screw a stupid bonus that barely covers the taxes associated with that bonus.
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Post by ronniebass on Jul 27, 2015 18:33:14 GMT -5
I have to agree with taking a lower or no sign on bonus with increases on the check. People have to understand how much more money can be made over the length of the contract and on retiremnent. Same goes with COLA instead of lump sum check in June. One thing we need to remember is sometime in 2016 with the launch of the 17 model, the entire plant will be on 3 crew 4 day work week and the OT will not be there. OT only over 40 hrs and I know this will hurt a lot of people. I don't see getting our 1 minute break back or Monday after Easter with all the major issues like 2 tier, pay increase, retirees and insurance plans. I'm sure Ford will throw out that carrot like last time with the huge sign on bonus and paying half of profit share by the end of the year but I'm not buying it. There has to be a pay increase on the check for everyone for me to even consider a yes vote. When it comes to what we want and need from Ford, reminds me of what my Dad used to always say......"Shit in one and wish in the other and see which one comes first". Everyone needs to wake up and realize that we made Ford what it is today and we sacrificed for many years. Ford made BILLIONS over this current contract and it's time we get compensated for our hard work.
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Post by ScottR@KTP on Aug 1, 2015 16:06:58 GMT -5
Talked to a buddy of mine that's been a UPS driver for 20 years... We always made more per hour than they did... But he's continued to get raises and COLA for the last ten years unlike us... He's at $32+ an hour... Almost $4 an hour more... Time for us to catch up or pass again.
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Post by Ktp1989 on Aug 1, 2015 16:29:33 GMT -5
UPS also have part time employees that still make what I made in 1988 working there at $8.50 an hour...give Ford the option of paying some of it's employees that rate and we could get to that level real quick...worked for the Teamsters until I came to Ford in 1989...I wasn't impressed.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 2, 2015 13:15:24 GMT -5
Yep things are tough all over. How many remember when working at Kroger was about as good a job as ford? Back in the seventies ford wasn't any better a place to work than most other places. It's been a steady decline for years and years. People don't see it though. Now the working class looks at autoworkers and says we are overpaid. They don't see what has really gone on. They turn on us and want us chopped down too. Sheeple. The new world order brought to u by both republicans and democrats. Our whole way of life is being undermined and our answer is to turn on each other. Too bad more people can't turn off the tv, video game, Facebook and start to wake up. "Soylent green is people" everyone should give up an hour a day of social media and read " this perfect day" by Ira Levin and then " 1984" by George Orwell. It couldn't possibly hurt.
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Post by ScottR@KTP on Aug 2, 2015 13:38:01 GMT -5
UPS also have part time employees that still make what I made in 1988 working there at $8.50 an hour...give Ford the option of paying some of it's employees that rate and we could get to that level real quick...worked for the Teamsters until I came to Ford in 1989...I wasn't impressed. How many part timers is Ford paying at KTP? I'm impressed, he's gotten a raise every year for the last 10 years while we haven't. |
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Post by Ex-metalman on Aug 2, 2015 14:06:37 GMT -5
Regardless of what the lower or part time employees make we should be at that 32 dolled rate now..Its our workforce and leaders..They have the mentality of "At least you have a job".Thats why we have nothing to show for the last 10 years but some bonuses that you can use for some plane tickets to Florida or Vegas..Gone ...We need numbers added to our rate...Strike is not and option here and they (ford) got us in the palm of their hand...Unless we stand together for a better future!
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Post by hanswolo77 on Aug 10, 2015 13:38:43 GMT -5
With settles saying today. We're negotiating smart and for the future sounds like we did that for 10 years and lost money. And now that same philosophy is gonna screw us again. How does this work both ways
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Post by Ex-metalman on Aug 10, 2015 13:49:46 GMT -5
Yea I saw that and immediately thought WEAKNESS!!!!Just like the Co did..Its pathetic when you have a leader (lmao)that starts out talking how we are gonna take it easy on the Co..???I hope Dennis Williams at least has some balls!If we get a raise its gonna be around .60 cents,and then bonuses the other 3 yrs..We will get screwed.Im still hoping for a buyout or early out..I'm sick of this (at least I have a job)mentality!!bullshit..
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