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Post by machination on Nov 22, 2015 14:33:55 GMT -5
I would ask machination...He's the smartest and wisest of all ...I think he has a degree or wears Degree antiperspirant ???Either way very very intelligent ...Just ask him... You're right. I've done nothing but lie this entire time... I don't know the answer. I don't remember right now. I have a headache and shouldn't even be on here. I think I'm going to lay down. |
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Post by machination on Nov 22, 2015 14:28:55 GMT -5
Great post nra4life...  Complete and utter nonsense. By the way, FYI, Local 600 is made up of far more than Dearborn Truck. In addition to Dearborn Truck, another 4600 UAW represented hourly workers work in 8 other Ford Facilities represented by UAW Local 600. They all have their own building chairmen and bargaining committees. Do you really think they were all "intimidated" by the union? Really? Why do you imagine they are more easily "intimidated" than you? You guys crack me up! The "no" voters here were intimidated by other "no" voters because they don't have the balls to stand up to them and just want to fit in... |
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Post by machination on Nov 22, 2015 14:26:57 GMT -5
I did vote yes. I looked at it and voted what I felt was best for me. The signing bonus did not however have any role in my decision. Others voted no and I respect that. I don't judge people based on their politics or how they feel about the union either way. I for one feel the UAW can do much better. WE can do better. But I'm not going to jump ship at the the first opportunity. If we want change we need to effect change from within. The contract passed plain and simple. Maybe next time we can ask for more. These people will not believe that the signing bonus didn't affect your judgment. They think everyone who doesn't march lock-step in line with them is weak, scared, lying about their reasons, a union shill, or just dumb, even though their stupidity is over the top. I respect reasonable people, but I don't owe any respect to destructive, dishonest idiots, sorry. I hope when rtw comes the most vocal and ignorant of them do leave the union. They are nothing but trouble, and will bring us nothing but trouble in the future. Sadly, their opting out wont stop them from being a terrible influence on younger and newer workers who don't know any better. |
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Post by machination on Nov 22, 2015 14:17:20 GMT -5
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Post by machination on Nov 22, 2015 14:09:34 GMT -5
We don't get to vote on any and every thing that we want to. Take a 40 hour week, that's around 173 hours per month. From that the union takes 2.5 hours pay for dues. That leaves you with 170.5. I made over 70k last year. If someone has a huge problem with having to pay 2.5 hours pay per month in order to get agreements that put your income at double the national average, allowing you to have a nice big house and a middle-class life, then they are truly ungrateful for what they have. Oh no, not 2.5 hours pay! How will I ever survive!... Ha, yea. And I believe the dues haven't been raised since what, sometime in the 1960's? Right to work is coming, then all the titty-baby leeches will be able to get what they've always dreamed of. High wages and benefits without having to contribute a dime. Then years from now when the unions are all gone and the companies get to dictate to you exactly what your pay and benefits will be, without us having ANY say in the matter whatsoever, you'll have all the leeches to blame for it. You are absolutely incorrect about are dues not being raised since the 1960's.Our dues were raised every time we got a raise,something that hasn't happened in over ten years. I agree with you about keeping the union to help protect our jobs from unfair practices by company and have every intention of remaining in union and paying dues Dues remained at a rate of 2 hours pay per month all that time until the recent change. Of course if you get a raise then 2 hours pay will be more than it was prior to the raise, but it was still 2 HOURS PAY all the time. You sir are a liar, and here is a link to prove that you are a liar: www.thefreedictionary.com/sophistrySadly, there are many, many people who are simply too stupid to understand that you are a liar even after it is proved. |
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Post by machination on Nov 22, 2015 14:06:40 GMT -5
If you have no problem with right-to-leech then you have no problem with people reaping good wages and benefits without having to contribute anything, further weakening the union, resulting in even worse contracts down the road, resulting in more leeches who don't get it, further weakening the union, resulting in even worse contracts down the road, and so on. Contracts where you wont be getting anything except continued employment. Gee lets make the union stronger by slashing the amount of money it gets! BRILLIANT!... What are you even talking about? You realize that you can still be in an union and pay union dues in right to work states? If my state was right to work, the only thing that would change is that I wouldn't be FORCED to pay union dues and the union would have to EARN them. What's wrong with that? What union is going to work harder for their workers? A union that has to earn the worker's money or a union that gets the money regardless of whether they're a good union or not? And it's funny how people talk about how terrible the leadership at the UAW is....but then fund their every little move with no question. You helped fund everything Jimmy Settles and crew did. How does that make you feel? Do you feel like they earned your money? How do you like the contract and the past contracts? Did they put your money to good use? You seem confused. Unions don't get stronger because they're receiving a lot of money. The union received $250Million from dues last year. Are you of the opinion that that money was used wisely and that the leadership worked hard to earn that money and that they represented the membership well? To answer your second question: No shit. I've already answered the rest time and again. You wouldn't make the wage you do, or get the benefits you have, without the union negiotiating it for you. If things are so bad for you here, quit. If you don't want to pay dues, then you're a leech. It's really simple. The stupidity and inability for so many people here to understand such basic, easy things is very sad, and I'm losing my faith in the intelligence of the American worker as a result. It's so terribly sad. |
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Post by machination on Nov 22, 2015 13:59:54 GMT -5
So why isn't it a 8 yr contract??I wanna believe that the 8 yr thing is true,but how can you believe this Union???Ill bet ANYBODY that they don't get top pay in 8 yrs.. thats just the scare tactic that the "no" voters were using. i hired in 2002, contract was up in 2003. we never worried that they would change our progression during the 2003 negotiations, nor should these people. Oh but "no" voters didn't use any scare tactics, only their enemy the union did remember? It's pointless arguing anymore with these people justaworker. The level of stupidity is beyond measure. It's absolutely impossible. They've made up their minds' and nothing is going to change it. Even though us 95's got our top pay a contract later, even though it took us 95's 8-9 years to reach $28/hr, none of that matters. You just can't reason with people who are so completely and absolutely infected with stupidity. |
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Post by machination on Nov 21, 2015 14:44:41 GMT -5
Wow. Are you really so out of touch with reality? A lot of these young people will never make over $20 per hour anywhere else. I hope no young people look up to or take advice from you, because you give terrible advice. would you honestly tell your kids to work at ford... No, because of all the awful people here. But if they were already here I sure wouldn't tell them to quit... |
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Post by machination on Nov 21, 2015 14:36:27 GMT -5
If you are thinking of taking the money and running,and you're single and under 30 yrs old ..Do it!!!Unless you like crazy ass schedules,not watching your kids grow up,divorce,surgeries,and shitty contracts(lol)..I love this place... Wow. Are you really so out of touch with reality? A lot of these young people will never make over $20 per hour anywhere else. I hope no young people look up to or take advice from you, because you give terrible advice. |
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Post by machination on Nov 21, 2015 13:40:18 GMT -5
So when is the bonus check going to hit our direct deposit? 2 weeks from today? You're welcome. |
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Post by machination on Nov 20, 2015 21:05:23 GMT -5
I think they were wore out and in shock that a good agreement with more gains than most people expected met such fierce opposition from so many people. And they're also in the position to know where this could lead down the road, if not now. What if Ford says, alright, we'll give you more, but we're cutting our investment pledge and in 4 years Sterling closes (they can get parts from somebody else) and 8 after that LAP goes. Squeeze the fuck out of the golden goose till she squirts some eggs but don't kill the damn thing. Being that 1,000 votes might be the diff...get new hires to full pay in 4 years and this passes. They prolly didn't need to give us raises or COLA if the diff is less than 1,000. I agree with the new hire part but if we weren't getting a raise I think it would still be a hard sell. |
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Post by machination on Nov 20, 2015 21:04:07 GMT -5
I think they were wore out and in shock that a good agreement with more gains than most people expected met such fierce opposition from so many people. And they're also in the position to know where this could lead down the road, if not now. What if Ford says, alright, we'll give you more, but we're cutting our investment pledge and in 4 years Sterling closes (they can get parts from somebody else) and 8 after that LAP goes. Squeeze the fuck out of the golden goose till she squirts some eggs but don't kill the damn thing. Would be cool IF YOU COULD SEE INTO THE FUTURE,and get ready for all the speculative points you bring up..But we can't so give me MINE now.Ill worry about plant closings when its ours... I'd rather retire at KTP. You don't have to be a psychic to have a little foresight. Here, check for yourself en.wiktionary.org/wiki/foresight |
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Post by machination on Nov 20, 2015 20:57:38 GMT -5
I thought 2+2+2+2=9.4% LOL LOL, only to remember1976.  |
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Post by machination on Nov 20, 2015 20:56:46 GMT -5
Union is its own worst enemy, spend millions to try to get the transplants with no luck, then get a free commercial the other day, national media there, every network covering that joke of a press conference and what does the UAW stand up there and say. Not "well the membership isnt happy with the deal, we will roll our sleeves up and get back in there and try to squeeze some more out of them, we will fight for them" no...they say "the company dont have any more money, the membership just dont understand the deal" if your a toyota worker why would you want to pay for that kind of represntation? I think they were wore out and in shock that a good agreement with more gains than most people expected met such fierce opposition from so many people. And they're also in the position to know where this could lead down the road, if not now. What if Ford says, alright, we'll give you more, but we're cutting our investment pledge and in 4 years Sterling closes (they can get parts from somebody else) and 8 after that LAP goes. Squeeze the fuck out of the golden goose till she squirts some eggs but don't kill the damn thing. |
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Post by machination on Nov 20, 2015 20:52:06 GMT -5
I never said it wasn't logical. In fact we already talked about this. I'd prefer COLA but it needs to start at a fair amount and not from a nickel or dime. I didn't think with all the other gains and the fact that we still receive an equivalent-to-70-cent-cola bonus that the contract was bad enough to reject. It wasn't bad at all. We don't even need COLA...4 2% raises and it passes. That works. I'd rather have that than the 3,0,3,0 since after four years the current idea only gives us around 6% raises while a 2,2,2,2 pushes us up over 8%. We'd lose almost $5,000 in bonuses HOWEVER we could make that back in time, especially if on overtime, and have higher base wage. Of course, that PLUS cola would be even better. And fair too. But I don't think Ford will go that far yet. |
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Post by machination on Nov 20, 2015 20:43:40 GMT -5
I agree Machination.. Being the # 1 Paint Department in the GLOBAL Ford Industry (( LAP )) and producing 20% of a Company's Net PROFIT, that has exceded 9 BILLION Dollars more than once recently, and also done from a Small building thats Land Locked.. Not Bad,.. Maybe I was expecting just a little bit more from our IUAW.... Pay the Workers.... I might be misunderstanding, but you aren't suggesting that they pay workers at one local, ours, more than they pay workers at the other assembly plants are you? |
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Post by machination on Nov 20, 2015 20:40:09 GMT -5
How can you say it's not logical to expect to stay with inflation if we account for less than 7% of the window sticker?  2% more, we stay with inflation, care to guess how many less billions of net profit they earn giving us 2% more? Instead of $8.2 billion net profit, they could've earned $7.9 billion with everyone making legacy wages in 2014. I never said it wasn't logical. In fact we already talked about this. I'd prefer COLA but it needs to start at a fair amount and not from a nickel or dime. I didn't think with all the other gains and the fact that we still receive an equivalent-to-70-cent-cola bonus that the contract was bad enough to reject. It wasn't bad at all. |
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Post by machination on Nov 20, 2015 20:37:01 GMT -5
Me too. See? We all agree on the end goals. We just have different ideas of the pace it can realistically take and the methods in which to get there asap without getting knocked back a step. Union & Ford both claim there isnt another nickel....the union can come back with the same deal, give my my 1/2 of month pay back they stole from me, and I will give them a yes vote. If no nickels left give me my $14.49 back and we can call it a deal. God damn crooks I'm afraid we're going to have to increase membership back to 1990's and earlier levels if you want a dues reduction. This is another reason why you guys shouldn't bash the union so much, or unions in general. We can all get stronger if our union had a lot more members. Strength in numbers. But other people hear so much negativity and they turn against unions too. People that say crap that turns other people against unions contribute to the weakening overall economic power of the dwindling middle-class and directly help make the future look worse, not better, for their own descendants. |
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Post by machination on Nov 20, 2015 20:31:20 GMT -5
Machination, ask the Union German Automakers if this is such a Great Wage.. I'm sure the folks in Alabama think were King of the hill also.. Care to join them.. Hummmm Naa, the southerners should join us, but they've guzzled so much republican Kool-Aid they're sure to make substandard wages for generations. We can't get to $50/hr in a contract or two. That would take a long time and would also require a massive shift in the collective mentality of our culture, on a grass-roots all the way to upper political levels. The people, ironically as it seems, aren't ready for unskilled laborers to make $50/hr. Our country needs to change a lot more. |
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Post by machination on Nov 20, 2015 20:24:43 GMT -5
But you could still run for committeeman and get elected and work your way up. Just sayin'. Everyone is so busy bashing every official in the union that they can't understand that we actually got stuff back in this contract, and lost nothing. Nothing. This contract is nothing but GAINS. How can you folks not see that? It's a great step in the RIGHT direction. Amen, definitely a step in the right direction... Just a baby step... I want the step of a seven footer. Me too. See? We all agree on the end goals. We just have different ideas of the pace it can realistically take and the methods in which to get there asap without getting knocked back a step. |
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Post by machination on Nov 20, 2015 20:20:19 GMT -5
Don't know about you, but no, I haven't made good money (vs inflation) since the early 2000(s)...I made the most between 2000-2003. If we had continued to get raises, and were at $33-35 per hour liked we should be (if we had negotiators that were truly on our side), that would be good money. Think what you could do with an extra $15,000 a year on 40 hours. Believe me man I'd love to be making $33+ per hour but it's too far above industry wages for unskilled labor. We got too used to how fast we got to $28 back in the day. Our wages rose, back then, INSANELY fast. In 95 assembler pay was 17.94 and it was at 28 after what, 8-9 years or so? We were fortunate to hire in when we did. Our wages just will not rise that fast again. We'll be over $30 base in 3 years with this contract IF it passes. C'mon man. You're a smart guy, you know darn good and well that this is GREAT money, let alone good. We gain much with this agreement. |
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Post by machination on Nov 20, 2015 20:13:44 GMT -5
It's not rocket science. If he, or you, think you could do a better job negotiating the contract, then why aren't you up north helping to do it? That's wtf I'm talking about. Only way to get up there is to have them bring you up, not like I can run a campain and get put on a ballot and get elected. But you could still run for committeeman and get elected and work your way up. Just sayin'. Everyone is so busy bashing every official in the union that they can't understand that we actually got stuff back in this contract, and lost nothing. Nothing. This contract is nothing but GAINS. How can you folks not see that? It's a great step in the RIGHT direction. |
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Post by machination on Nov 20, 2015 20:07:50 GMT -5
Maybe you could do a better job yourself? I was replying to the question above mine. I don't necessarily believe that article. BTW, what's ISIS and George W Bush have to do with this? It was in response to people wanting to be able to vote for international officials so I pointed out the absolutely horrible judgement many people have and used GB to highlight that as an example reinforcing my argument. Damn you folks are slow tonight! C'mon people. |
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Post by machination on Nov 20, 2015 20:06:00 GMT -5
Keep being influenced by "Louisville's Own Rush Limbaugh", who spent "most of his adult life in business management and ownership" despite his so-called "blue collar background"... It's pretty obvious from the article that he's biased against unions. Maybe his "life" as a manager and owner has something to do with that. Maybe you folks think he could get you a better deal. Sheep, all of ya. And a direct vote on international would be a bad idea. You people are too dangerous. I bet most of you voted for George Bush, twice. ISIS appreciates that, very much, since without Bush destroying Iraq they never would have had to opportunity to form and exist. You guys want to select our international union leaders too? No thanks... "Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups." - George Carlin So do the 10,000 poor Terrorist your pathetic Isis prez.Is going to let come in..Of course they are fully vetted...hahaha.... Hell no, keep them out. I never voted for him either. |
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Post by machination on Nov 20, 2015 20:04:58 GMT -5
Maybe you could do a better job yourself? Wtf are you talking about? It's not rocket science. If he, or you, think you could do a better job negotiating the contract, then why aren't you up north helping to do it? That's wtf I'm talking about. |
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Post by machination on Nov 20, 2015 20:03:19 GMT -5
Getting ready to open a bottle of blackberry wine and get in the hot tub. I bought the hot tub when we made good money. We don't make good money? |
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Post by machination on Nov 20, 2015 19:52:11 GMT -5
Someone just told me of a petition to remove Settles, maybe on Facebook? Maybe you could do a better job yourself? |
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Post by machination on Nov 20, 2015 19:48:23 GMT -5
Keep being influenced by "Louisville's Own Rush Limbaugh", who spent "most of his adult life in business management and ownership" despite his so-called "blue collar background"... It's pretty obvious from the article that he's biased against unions. Maybe his "life" as a manager and owner has something to do with that. Maybe you folks think he could get you a better deal.
Sheep, all of ya. And a direct vote on international would be a bad idea. You people are too dangerous. I bet most of you voted for George Bush, twice. ISIS appreciates that, very much, since without Bush destroying Iraq they never would have had to opportunity to form and exist. You guys want to select our international union leaders too? No thanks...
"Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups."
- George Carlin
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Post by machination on Nov 20, 2015 16:58:52 GMT -5
Of course I am..It was like we "haven't had a raise since 02" humor... Fair enough. I thought you were serious lol. Well I've got some Jagermeister too if the champagne doesn't do the trick. You know metalman, that's the kind of sarcasm I'd expect to hear from a yes voter.  |
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Post by machination on Nov 20, 2015 16:55:15 GMT -5
I sure hope you guys are right about vote rigging and fraud since the vote's going to be so close. I've got a bottle of champagne I'm waiting to pop open if it passes. Though (tho) if it FAILS 49-51 i guess your theories on that get exposed as just more bullshit, so either way I still win How can you afford champagne on a UAW ford workers salary???lmao??? I really hope you're just kidding. You are kidding right? Jesus christ dude, do you get out? You can buy champagne for less than $20..... I need a drink just reading this board... |
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